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Has Jack Trump outwitted Steve Peters?

Postby Badsnookerplayer

Jack Trump has provided a certain 'je ne sais quoi' for Judd that has seen him march on to near total domination of the sport.

What do you think is Jack's secret formula for success and how has he managed to humble Steve Peters and Sightright so quickly?

Re: Has Jack Trump outwitted Steve Peters?

Postby D4P

The (obvious) flaw in your logic is that Jack worked with a different player than Steve/Sightright worked with, such that any difference in outcomes might be a result of differences in the players rather than differences in the coaches. But nice try nonetheless.

From what I can tell, Jack mostly just convinced Judd to practice more and to play fewer ill-advised shots. Judd (like Ronnie) has long been an underachiever relative to his talent level, and Jack's efforts have essentially just helped Judd to start playing the way he should have been playing all along.

In Ronnie's case, he has major psychological issues that stand in the way of his success and that ultimately lead to self-sabotaging behavior. Those issues can't be addressed simply by putting in more hours at the practice table or by playing safe instead of taking on very low percentage pots...

Re: Has Jack Trump outwitted Steve Peters?

Postby D4P

Perhaps the people that deserve the most credit for Judd's near total domination are the pundits who touted Kyren Wilson as "the next big thing". That really seemed to offend Judd and motivate him to try harder in an effort to prove his critics wrong.

Up until the Kyren Wilson-stuff happened, Judd seemed content to win a title once a year or so and to make enough money to support his playboy lifestyle. But once the gauntlet was thrown down, he seemed to have adopted a different mindset and a different approach.

Re: Has Jack Trump outwitted Steve Peters?

Postby Cloud Strife

Jack Trump deserves all the credit in the world for helping to mastermind victories over the likes of Tom Ford, Zhang Anda and Jordan Brown. It's doubtful Judd could have beaten those guys on his own without Jack holding his hand, so fair play to him.

Re: Has Jack Trump outwitted Steve Peters?

Postby gallantrabbit

It's very interesting to know that Trump thought he was near his WC level against Selby because that's by far the best snooker I've ever seen. Not sure he can keep quite this level up but he could be the first to threaten true domination for a long time. Not sure how much credit Jack gets but some for sure.

Re: Has Jack Trump outwitted Steve Peters?

Postby rekoons

D4P wrote:Perhaps the people that deserve the most credit for Judd's near total domination are the pundits who touted Kyren Wilson as "the next big thing". That really seemed to offend Judd and motivate him to try harder in an effort to prove his critics wrong.

Up until the Kyren Wilson-stuff happened, Judd seemed
content to win a title once a year or so and to make
money to support his playboy lifestyle. But once the
was thrown down, he seemed to have adopted a
different mindset and a different approach.


Yes that seemed to have stung him

Re: Has Jack Trump outwitted Steve Peters?

Postby SnookerFan

D4P wrote:Perhaps the people that deserve the most credit for Judd's near total domination are the pundits who touted Kyren Wilson as "the next big thing". That really seemed to offend Judd and motivate him to try harder in an effort to prove his critics wrong.

Up until the Kyren Wilson-stuff happened, Judd seemed content to win a title once a year or so and to make enough money to support his playboy lifestyle. But once the gauntlet was thrown down, he seemed to have adopted a different mindset and a different approach.


Yeah. I never got that Kyren being the best player in the world rhetoric that the commentators were giving it.

It did annoy Judd though. Maybe this has been his response.

Re: Has Jack Trump outwitted Steve Peters?

Postby Ace

Not even close lmao all Jack's brother did was make Judd practice more, play more safety and don't go for stupid shots. It was just about improving Judd's level of play.

Steve Peters is a professional psychiatrist who has to deal with sports stars mental demons which get in the way of their performance ala Ronnie. 100x more harder. If there is perfection in terms of pure snooker ability, then it's Ronnie's. Everyone and their mothers wants to play like Ronnie but despite close to perfection game, it was mental demons which hindered him lots of times.

Usually the most talented ppl have some mental flaws, Federer is like this although not to Ronnie's extent, his mental ability has never been on the same level as Nadal or Djokovic despite being Mr Tennis.

Re: Has Jack Trump outwitted Steve Peters?

Postby Dan-cat

Ace wrote:Not even close lmao all Jack's brother did was make Judd practice more, play more safety and don't go for stupid shots. It was just about improving Judd's level of play.

Steve Peters is a professional psychiatrist who has to deal with sports stars mental demons which get in the way of their performance ala Ronnie. 100x more harder. If there is perfection in terms of pure snooker ability, then it's Ronnie's. Everyone and their mothers wants to play like Ronnie but despite close to perfection game, it was mental demons which hindered him lots of times.

Usually the most talented ppl have some mental flaws, Federer is like this although not to Ronnie's extent, his mental ability has never been on the same level as Nadal or Djokovic despite being Mr Tennis.


+1

God damn your expositions turn me on. Bang on post.

I think (hope) Baddy meant this thread as tongue in cheek.

Re: Has Jack Trump outwitted Steve Peters?

Postby D4P

Dan-cat wrote:I think (hope) Baddy meant this thread as tongue in cheek.


He was just taking an (indirect) shot at Ronnie. It's a commonly-used tactic that masks an underlying jealousy.

Re: Has Jack Trump outwitted Steve Peters?

Postby Badsnookerplayer

D4P wrote:
Dan-cat wrote:I think (hope) Baddy meant this thread as tongue in cheek.


He was just taking an (indirect) shot at Ronnie. It's a commonly-used tactic that masks an underlying jealousy.

Well not really D4P.

I think it is interesting.

I think because Jack is a working class lad, people say that he just tells Judd to practice more (presumably because working class people are unintelligent and can't understand sport science or psychology).

Steve Peters on the other hand being solid middle class is viewed as a genius and deep thinker. The class system and snobbery are alive and well in the UK.

Interesting responses to what - I think - is a fair question to ask. Based on the WC and watching Judd and Ronnie's performance, who would you think had the better mind coach?

Re: Has Jack Trump outwitted Steve Peters?

Postby TheRocket

Not yet. During the Peters era Ronnie won two world titles in a row and reached three consecutive world finals. He won tons of other titles including multiple UK's and Masters titles. He still wins a heck of a lot but atm it gets overshadowed by his recent Crucible record.

Not sure though whether Ronnie even works as much with Peters as he did in the early days.

Re: Has Jack Trump outwitted Steve Peters?

Postby Ace

Badsnookerplayer wrote:
D4P wrote:
Dan-cat wrote:I think (hope) Baddy meant this thread as tongue in cheek.


He was just taking an (indirect) shot at Ronnie. It's a commonly-used tactic that masks an underlying jealousy.

Well not really D4P.

I think it is interesting.

I think because Jack is a working class lad, people say that he just tells Judd to practice more (presumably because working class people are unintelligent and can't understand sport science or psychology).

Steve Peters on the other hand being solid middle class is viewed as a genius and deep thinker. The class system and snobbery are alive and well in the UK.

Interesting responses to what - I think - is a fair question to ask. Based on the WC and watching Judd and Ronnie's performance, who would you think had the better mind coach?


Wtf are you on about class system? Take that tinfoil hat off son

Judd is Jack's brother who is 99% gonna be more willing to listen to because he's a family member, nothing else. He just practices more Judd has himself said this. He came back to the table and worked twice as hard after the media kept putting him down.

Steve Peters is a friggin' well know sports psychiatrist who has worked with TONS of other sports players who have all credited him, heck he has even worked with football teams. He has a better catalogue of credentials not to mention they are completely different, one tells the other to practice more, while the other is a professional psychiatrist whose job is to sort of players mentality, he doesn't take balls out of the pocket like Jack's brother does. His job is to help sportsmen overcome mental demons that get in the way of their performance, meaning, those sportsmen have the ability to win but due to their mental hindrance it stops them from winning.

Judd didn't have these problems lmao

Steve Peters wouldn't work on Judd for example and Jack's brother wouldn't have the same effect on Ronnie either. They had 2 different problems.

Re: Has Jack Trump outwitted Steve Peters?

Postby Ace

With Judd it was always about improving level of play. Hence the improved safety, not taking on stupid shots etc and just generally showing patience instead of going gung-ho on the table.

It worked in 2011 but he was very young then and utterly fearless.

Now it's controlled aggression.

Re: Has Jack Trump outwitted Steve Peters?

Postby Pink Ball

Ace wrote:
Badsnookerplayer wrote:
D4P wrote:
Dan-cat wrote:I think (hope) Baddy meant this thread as tongue in cheek.


He was just taking an (indirect) shot at Ronnie. It's a commonly-used tactic that masks an underlying jealousy.

Well not really D4P.

I think it is interesting.

I think because Jack is a working class lad, people say that he just tells Judd to practice more (presumably because working class people are unintelligent and can't understand sport science or psychology).

Steve Peters on the other hand being solid middle class is viewed as a genius and deep thinker. The class system and snobbery are alive and well in the UK.

Interesting responses to what - I think - is a fair question to ask. Based on the WC and watching Judd and Ronnie's performance, who would you think had the better mind coach?


Wtf are you on about class system? Take that tinfoil hat off son

Judd is Jack's brother who is 99% gonna be more willing to listen to because he's a family member, nothing else. He just practices more Judd has himself said this. He came back to the table and worked twice as hard after the media kept putting him down.

Steve Peters is a friggin' well know sports psychiatrist who has worked with TONS of other sports players who have all credited him, heck he has even worked with football teams. He has a better catalogue of credentials not to mention they are completely different, one tells the other to practice more, while the other is a professional psychiatrist whose job is to sort of players mentality, he doesn't take balls out of the pocket like Jack's brother does. His job is to help sportsmen overcome mental demons that get in the way of their performance, meaning, those sportsmen have the ability to win but due to their mental hindrance it stops them from winning.

Judd didn't have these problems lmao

Steve Peters wouldn't work on Judd for example and Jack's brother wouldn't have the same effect on Ronnie either. They had 2 different problems.

I don't believe it. A thoughtful and accurate post.