Dafabet Masters Final : Ronnie O'Sullivan v Judd Trump

eraserhead wrote:

Ash147 wrote:

eraserhead wrote:One thing about Judd. I find him very hard to access. He looks more comfortable in finals then he does in the match before the finals.

Why are you trying to access him?

Strictly scientific purposes.

It's all gone abit gay on here.

eraserhead wrote:One thing about Judd. I find him very hard to access. He looks more comfortable in finals then he does in the match before the finals.

Not sure. He's got to 18 ranking finals, won 9 and lost 9.

But playing ROS certainly brings the best out of him atm. In finals even more so. He can be a strange player. You give him a much better chance of beating someone like ROS,Selby or Robertson in a World final than beating Perry or Bingham probably.

TheRocket wrote:

eraserhead wrote:One thing about Judd. I find him very hard to access. He looks more comfortable in finals then he does in the match before the finals.

Not sure. He's got to 18 ranking finals, won 9 and lost 9.

But playing ROS certainly brings the best out of him atm. In finals even more so. He can be a strange player. You give him a much better chance of beating someone like ROS,Selby or Robertson in a World final than beating Perry or Bingham probably.

Or Hawkins. I do wonder if all this Kyren talk has helped Judd. For all the progress Kyren's made it's still Judd that's actually winning the bigger ranking events and now a triple crown event.

eraserhead wrote:

TheRocket wrote:

eraserhead wrote:One thing about Judd. I find him very hard to access. He looks more comfortable in finals then he does in the match before the finals.

Not sure. He's got to 18 ranking finals, won 9 and lost 9.

But playing ROS certainly brings the best out of him atm. In finals even more so. He can be a strange player. You give him a much better chance of beating someone like ROS,Selby or Robertson in a World final than beating Perry or Bingham probably.

Or Hawkins. I do wonder if all this Kyren talk has helped Judd. For all the progress Kyren's made it's still Judd that's actually winning the bigger ranking events and now a triple crown event.

Judd definitely seems to have chosen "fight over flight" in response to the perceived slight of being ranked lower than Kyren in terms of reputation...

D4P wrote:Judd definitely seems to have chosen "fight over flight" in response to the perceived slight of being ranked lower than Kyren in terms of reputation...

I don't think he was ever ranked lower in terms of achievement. Just hadn't had a good run in a big event recently. Would love to see Kyren respond now because it's good for snooker to have a rivalry between the younger guys.

eraserhead wrote: I do wonder if all this Kyren talk has helped Judd. For all the progress Kyren's made it's still Judd that's actually winning the bigger ranking events and now a triple crown event.

That's cause Judd is way more talented. A less talented player can close the gap or even surpass a more talented one if he works harder, is more committed and is mentally strong and stable. But if the talented guy starts putting in the same amount of hard work and dedication, he'll shine brighter, it's only common sense.

Up until a few months ago, that was the case with Judd and Kyren and that's why people were saying Kyren is a bigger prospect for the future.

In a way, it's just like doping. If they're all on the same juice, the one with the best genetics/talent will come out on top.

That Judd-Kyren rivalry is gonna be interesting.

Judd is certainly miles ahead of Kyren atm. But should Kyren win a world title before Judd does it would change things a little bit. For me Judd would still be the better player but people would say that Judd cant do it on the big stage while his rival (who has won much less) does and stuff like that. And that would hurt Judd.

So in terms of who wins the World title first its an exciting race.

I agree it adds spice to see who will be first to win a WC.

Judd has a rare opportunity to build upon his successes now and move into dominance (as far as that is possible in the current game) or return to old bad habits and be content with the odd win.

I personally hope that he has the taste for more. He has had a good season so far and there is nothing to stop him becoming WC. He has the potential - and the time - to break many records.

It is in his hands.

Johnny Bravo wrote:Are u people still talking about the final ?!

It ended a while ago.

Judd won, ROS lost.
Judd played great from the get go and punished ROS's mistakes.
ROS struggled from the get go and didn't punish any of Judd's mistakes in the first session. I know he was under pressure and with his back against the wall, but even when he got easy openers and was among the reds, he couldn't score heavy enough.
He improved slightly and played better in the second session. But it was too little too late.

Congrats Trump for the win, he looks like he's matured as a player and that was obvious from his shot selection. The extra practice is also evident.

ROS has lost before, but he'll be back. He still has 2 or 3 years at the top of the game, therefore many more chances to win titles. Yesterday was just a bad day at the office.

Tell us about The Championship League.

Iranu wrote:
It's a bit hypocritical to say that Judd deserves credit for making Ronnie collapse while constantly complaining that players collapse against Ronnie without giving him any credit. And I say that as someone who has been annoyed at players rolling over for him.

Yeah - I understand what you are getting at but to answer the hypocritical part...

What I am saying is that a player does have an effect on his opponent - that much is obvious.

The difference is that Judd's effect on Ronnie was due to his play in the arena i.e. his safety and scoring. Ronnie could not respond to that yesterday.

That is different to players not turning up against an opponent because they are mentally intimidated. I believe that Ronnie does deserve credit for intimidating other players. They are intimidated because they know what he is capable of.

However, some rollovers by players to Ronnie have been embarrassing and they have effectively gifted him wins. The likes of Milkins, Ford etc. have just turned up and done nothing.

This is of course not O'Sullivans fault and he knocks them over as we would expect. In the future, somebody else will have that fear factor just as Hendry, Davis etc did in the past.and I will be willing their opponents to give them a better game.

Iranu wrote:Fair points BSP.

But I think people are forgetting that Ronnie did have chances in that afternoon session.

I don't think going 2-0 would make him collapse.

I agree

Badsnookerplayer wrote:However, some rollovers by players to Ronnie have been embarrassing and they have effectively gifted him wins. The likes of Milkins, Ford etc. have just turned up and done nothing.

Ronnie's intimidation factor seems particularly strong with the young Chinese players, possibly because he's such an idol for them in China...

Can’t wait for the match to start

Not for the first time, O'Sullivan fell apart like a cheap suit when a player decided he wasn't going to taken in with all of the O'Sullivan hype.

Welcome back Vodka.

I hope you have used your time away wisely

Badsnookerplayer wrote:Welcome back Vodka.

I hope you have used your time away wisely

Thanks Badsnookerplayer.

I have actually. I haven't quit gut laughing since about 9pm last night!

vodkadiet wrote:

Badsnookerplayer wrote:Welcome back Vodka.

I hope you have used your time away wisely

Thanks Badsnookerplayer.

I have actually. I haven't quit gut laughing since about 9pm last night!

Badsnookerplayer wrote:I agree it adds spice to see who will be first to win a WC.

Judd has a rare opportunity to build upon his successes now and move into dominance (as far as that is possible in the current game) or return to old bad habits and be content with the odd win.

I personally hope that he has the taste for more. He has had a good season so far and there is nothing to stop him becoming WC. He has the potential - and the time - to break many records.

It is in his hands.

I think he’s a fine player, but he’s not going to be a record-breaker. He has won far too little by 29 to suggest he’ll be anything of the sort.

TheRocket wrote:

Wildey wrote:

Badsnookerplayer wrote:I agree about his scoring totally Eraser.

Are you saying that Judd only won because Ronnie had a bad day.
i.e. Judd had no influence on it being a bad day.

Sorry but if people are saying that they are talking bullocks and has no understanding of top level sport.


Judd put Ronnie on the back foot from the off and he put the pressure on Ronnie and that is why Ronnie crumbled to 7-1.

The point is. If Ronnie was in good form he wouldnt have crumbled to a 7:1 deficite and folded.

He would have immediately responded after Trump started to make mistakes which he did a few from the third frame on. But Ronnie didnt take advantage and couldnt cope with the pressure.

Thats why its more than justified to say that he didnt play well.

In later life Hendry, Higgins and Davis have crumbled it happens and it might happen more and more now hes getting on a bit i suggest you get ready for it otherwise it will buck your brains out.

Sullivan did struggle to find his feet, but a lot of that is down to fearing what Trump is capable of. I don’t doubt he’s in his head now. He certainly respects him as a player. Ding arguably has a higher peak level than Trump but Sullivan knows Ding fears him and can, therefore, relax. Sullivan knows Trump is unlikely to buckle against him.

That’s not to say Sullivan won’t turn the tide. He thrives when trying to prove a point.

Wildey wrote:

TheRocket wrote:

Wildey wrote:

Badsnookerplayer wrote:I agree about his scoring totally Eraser.

Are you saying that Judd only won because Ronnie had a bad day.
i.e. Judd had no influence on it being a bad day.

Sorry but if people are saying that they are talking bullocks and has no understanding of top level sport.


Judd put Ronnie on the back foot from the off and he put the pressure on Ronnie and that is why Ronnie crumbled to 7-1.

The point is. If Ronnie was in good form he wouldnt have crumbled to a 7:1 deficite and folded.

He would have immediately responded after Trump started to make mistakes which he did a few from the third frame on. But Ronnie didnt take advantage and couldnt cope with the pressure.

Thats why its more than justified to say that he didnt play well.

In later life Hendry, Higgins and Davis have crumbled it happens and it might happen more and more now hes getting on a bit i suggest you get ready for it otherwise it will buck your brains out.

So its about age and the later life of a pro now? Ah interesting. Don't worry though. I'm quite relaxed.

But you're very fickle thats for sure. I've seen matches of ROS where he played to a much higher level than Trump ever did and you still end up moaning that his opponent didnt perform or didnt give him a match. Now, for a change, ROS is on the wrong end of a good but not even a great display and you say things like his opponent didnt allow him to perform or play his best game and stuff like that. Just dont be so fickle and two-faced dude. Its just pathetic.

Pink Ball wrote:That’s not to say Sullivan won’t turn the tide. He thrives when trying to prove a point.

It's an interesting observation. Ronnie (arguably?) didn't have much of a point to prove at the 2019 Masters. A win (by itself) wouldn't have gotten him any record he didn't already hold, and while it would have made the Grand Slam a possibility I don't think Ronnie has ever mentioned that as one of his goals. (On the contrary, he has said many times that he isn't "greedy" about winning all of the events).

If he has a point to prove it's at the WC, which is really the only remaining chink (relatively speaking) in his armor...

Calm down Rocket - I thought Wildey was just trying to say that it does happen to everybody at some time which is a fair point.

With ROS it hasn't happened yet by a long way but I don't think Wildey was saying that it has. Rather be prepared that it will.


We need people challenging ROS and somebody to take over at some point for the good of the game.


I always respect your posts but I think you might have got the wrong end of the stick here.

TheRocket wrote:

Wildey wrote:

TheRocket wrote:

Wildey wrote:

Badsnookerplayer wrote:I agree about his scoring totally Eraser.

Are you saying that Judd only won because Ronnie had a bad day.
i.e. Judd had no influence on it being a bad day.

Sorry but if people are saying that they are talking bullocks and has no understanding of top level sport.


Judd put Ronnie on the back foot from the off and he put the pressure on Ronnie and that is why Ronnie crumbled to 7-1.

The point is. If Ronnie was in good form he wouldnt have crumbled to a 7:1 deficite and folded.

He would have immediately responded after Trump started to make mistakes which he did a few from the third frame on. But Ronnie didnt take advantage and couldnt cope with the pressure.

Thats why its more than justified to say that he didnt play well.

In later life Hendry, Higgins and Davis have crumbled it happens and it might happen more and more now hes getting on a bit i suggest you get ready for it otherwise it will buck your brains out.

So its about age and the later life of a pro now? Ah interesting. Don't worry though. I'm quite relaxed.

But you're very fickle thats for sure. I've seen matches of ROS where he played to a much higher level than Trump ever did and you still end up moaning that his opponent didnt perform or didnt give him a match. Now, for a change, ROS is on the wrong end of a good but not even a great display and you say things like his opponent didnt allow him to perform or play his best game and stuff like that. Just dont be so fickle and two-faced dude. Its just pathetic.

Your right it is frustrating when players cant perform against certain players and sometime the frustration boils over.


im excited by the thought as Pink said that Trump is in Ronnies head its about time if truth be told we need this then we can really get excited that others will follow and the gap between Ronnie and everyone else will close and matches will get more exiting as a result.

vodkadiet wrote:Not for the first time, O'Sullivan fell apart like a cheap suit when a player decided he wasn't going to taken in with all of the O'Sullivan hype.

Welcome back

D4P wrote:

Pink Ball wrote:That’s not to say Sullivan won’t turn the tide. He thrives when trying to prove a point.

It's an interesting observation. Ronnie (arguably?) didn't have much of a point to prove at the 2019 Masters. A win (by itself) wouldn't have gotten him any record he didn't already hold, and while it would have made the Grand Slam a possibility I don't think Ronnie has ever mentioned that as one of his goals. (On the contrary, he has said many times that he isn't "greedy" about winning all of the events).

If he has a point to prove it's at the WC, which is really the only remaining chink (relatively speaking) in his armor...

You do talk sense.

@ BSP.

Speaking about the age of a player or the age factor is a fair point. And I think you know from my comments that I dont believe in this "ROS is playing as good as ever" stuff anyway. Because I don't think he is. Even though I'm quite amazed he can still compete at this age to this level tbh. Thats a different story however.

My point is that there's just too much hypocrisy going on in this forum. Especially from those who pretend to be neutral. Sometimes you'd think only reason ROS wins his matches is because all of his opponents are folding. Yes there a few. And even I make fun of players like Ford or Milkins. But lets be honest. Even if they were not scared they would still lose 8 out of 10 matches. Because Ronnie is simply a better player.