Post a reply

Snooker players to be banned from all bettings

Postby Monique

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/others ... tions.html
Players are already prohibited from betting on their own matches under the code of conduct of the World Professional Billiards and Snooker Association but so-called “insurance bets” on the highest break are permitted.

It means that if a player is on course for a cash prize for the highest break of a tournament, he is allowed to take out insurance by betting on his break being beaten.

But Barry Hearn, the WPBSA chairman, confirmed on Monday that even this form of betting would soon be outlawed and that players would be notified by letter that all snooker gambling was now off limits.

“The situation is currently being reviewed in terms of high-break betting,” said Hearn. “We need to make it crystal clear to players that they shouldn’t be betting on snooker in any matches in any way, and that includes the insurance betting on high breaks.”

The clampdown will bring snooker into line with the recommendations made earlier this year by the Sports Betting Integrity Panel, which was set up by sports minister Gerry Sutcliffe.

It recommended that sports should introduce rules to ensure that a participant does not “place or attempt to place a bet on a match, race or other event or competition in which he or his club participates”.

The move by the WPBSA is an attempt to rebuild the sport’s tarnished image after the accusations of match-fixing against Higgins, who was filmed allegedly accepting a bribe to throw frames.

Higgins, who is suspended from the sport pending disciplinary proceedings, insists he is “100 per cent innocent” and has promised to defend himself vigorously.

The world No 1 now faces fresh allegations that he also attempted to bet against himself during his 2009 World Championship final against Shaun Murphy, which he went on to win 18-9.

The WPBSA has confirmed that it is investigating the new accusations, which were made by a Ladbrokes call centre worker who refused to accept the bet. The bookmakers have promised to help the inquiry.

A WPBSA spokesman confirmed that all players would have been in no doubt that betting on their own matches was against the rules.

“They would all have been notified by letter,” the spokesman said.



bold set by me.

I think the first sentence put some discussions on here and other forums to bed. If Higgins tried to bet on his own match, whatever his aledged motives he was in breach of the rules and he knew it.

Now the rules will be even stricter.

Re: Snooker players to be banned from all bettings

Postby Casey

It’s the best move but lets be honest, it will change nothing. Players will still get their friends or family members to place bets for them.

I don’t really care either, as long as the player still tries his best to win.

Re: Snooker players to be banned from all bettings

Postby Wildey

case_master wrote:It’s the best move but lets be honest, it will change nothing. Players will still get their friends or family members to place bets for them.

I don’t really care either, as long as the player still tries his best to win.


in-fact ive told idiots on TSF all bloody weekend this was coming.

case your right but this directive does include family if it ever comes to light that a friend or family has done this nothing changes that player will be punished and rightly so.

Re: Snooker players to be banned from all bettings

Postby Casey

I am sure world snooker already know the answer to this. I wonder are they keeping their findings secret so not to interfere with the other investigation?

Re: Snooker players to be banned from all bettings

Postby NedB-H

this new one doesn't make any sense. So some guy at Ladbrokes knowingly took a call from a professional sportsman betting against himself, but didn't bother reporting it. Then a year later when the same player suddenly got accused elsewhere, the guy decides he'll reveal all after all. Doesn't add up.

Re: Snooker players to be banned from all bettings

Postby Sickpotter

Surely they would record bets taken by phone no? Why has there been nothing more than the accusation if there's any truth to it?

I agree with Ned, the timing of this new revalation is off. I'd say it's little more than a soon to be unemployed telephone operator at Lads trying for a few bucks from the paper....or rag, however you view it :john:

I think the move to ban players gambling full stop is the only option they had given all the stuff being dragged up It's the only way they (the board) can assure the public (and more importantly the bookies) that all tour events and players are on the up and up. Personally I've no issue with players getting high break insurance but it's just easier all around to say no to all player betting.

Certainly there are ways around it and some players might have friends or relatives place a bet. Beyond keeping an eye on player aquaintances/friends or family that's still tough to police. If a player REALLY wants to lay a bet I'm sure they'll find a way but hopefully those who'd stand to gain more from a bet than a win are far enough back in the rankings that their matches won't be relevant to the event outcome.

IMO restricting betting to the last 16 of all events would virtually ensure players stood more to gain from winning their matches than they would from any bet they could lay that wouldn't draw attention. Of course that concept won't float with some, heaven forbid the public miss an opportunity to take/make a bet. :roll:

Re: Snooker players to be banned from all bettings

Postby Witz78

sickpotter wrote:Surely they would record bets taken by phone no? Why has there been nothing more than the accusation if there's any truth to it?

I agree with Ned, the timing of this new revalation is off. I'd say it's little more than a soon to be unemployed telephone operator at Lads trying for a few bucks from the paper....or rag, however you view it :john:

I think the move to ban players gambling full stop is the only option they had given all the stuff being dragged up It's the only way they (the board) can assure the public (and more importantly the bookies) that all tour events and players are on the up and up. Personally I've no issue with players getting high break insurance but it's just easier all around to say no to all player betting.

Certainly there are ways around it and some players might have friends or relatives place a bet. Beyond keeping an eye on player aquaintances/friends or family that's still tough to police. If a player REALLY wants to lay a bet I'm sure they'll find a way but hopefully those who'd stand to gain more from a bet than a win are far enough back in the rankings that their matches won't be relevant to the event outcome.

IMO restricting betting to the last 16 of all events would virtually ensure players stood more to gain from winning their matches than they would from any bet they could lay that wouldn't draw attention. Of course that concept won't float with some, heaven forbid the public miss an opportunity to take/make a bet. :roll:


It wouldnt float the boat of the bookies first and foremost, there the ones who have more to lose than the punters if gambling opportunitied were restricted.

Anyway i dont agree with your concept of players not betting once it was the last 16 stage, were on this topic because the Higgins was betting on himself to lose in A WORLD FINAL, so no match is too high profile to be immune.

Re: Snooker players to be banned from all bettings

Postby Roland

"I think that we can say with certainty that Mooney was indeed the initial target of the sting: HE was approached by the NotW sting team initially, NOT Higgins. (All the detail is in the sting backgrounder piece linked in this piece).
I don’t know WHY Mooney was targeted. The NotW say because a “sport insider” told them they had suspicions over Mooney and Higgins. But the NotW don’t say who the insider was, or what evidence this insider produced: presumably none whatsoever because the NotW themselves have presented, so far, NO EVIDENCE WHATSOEVER that John Higgins has actually fixed anything at all.
Can we speculate why Mooney was targeted? Maybe someone genuinely believed he is or was corrupt. Maybe a business rival had a grudge. Maybe someone had a personal issue with him. I simply don’t know.
But I do know Mooney was targeted; the News of the World essentially confirms this itself several times across the coverage by writing about several meetings with Mooney (not Higgins) over a period of time.
In last week’s NotW coverage, the case against Higgins rests – as far as I can tell from anything printed or shown on video – ENTIRELY on what Mooney had told reporters prior to that 10-minute meeting, and then the meeting itself of course, where the damning – edited – video was filmed.
The NotW coverage itself says the deal had been agreed with Mooney; and now it was just up to Higgins to rubber-stamp it. My reading of that is not even the NoTW is claiming Higgins had knowledge of what Mooney had allegedly promised before that meeting.
I don’t know if Mooney is innocent or guilty (of actually fixing anything, as opposed to talking about fixing, and then in “exhibitions” according to last week’s NotW) but there is a strong evidential base for thinking he was at least stupid and mouthy and saying what people wanted to hear; this within the context of an elaborate entrapment. The NotW will argue entrapment in the public interest; that’s their right to argue that and as and when legal proceedings start, that will be debated."

Re: Snooker players to be banned from all bettings

Postby Wildey

you know what that pretty much summed it up how i thought after last weekend's video in the NOTW.

its ironic had John lived up to his seeding and reached the World semi final he wouldn't be there and nothing to answer for.

all i want is for it to be cleared up then get the EGM over with and move on with a sport that is looking up.

Re: Snooker players to be banned from all bettings

Postby Lucky

Impossible to police, you can set up an online account in any name funded from any paypal/credit card account. The only way to have a totally clean sport is if the players are trusted. The events of the last few weeks have thown snooker into a spin. IF you don't or can't trust the participants...then unfortunately you won't be able to trust nor enjoy the sport. Dont allow one or two bad apples cloud the issue and make out that the sport is rotten. 90% plus of all competitors are genuine and try their upmost in every event. You will get cheats in EVERY single sport, fom the highest level down to the lowest game of tiddlewinks in schools if you only concentrate on the negative headlines and forget all the positive things that have passed then you may as well give up on the sport and find another hobby.

Re: Snooker players to be banned from all bettings

Postby Wildey

Lucky balls wrote:Impossible to police, you can set up an online account in any name funded from any paypal/credit card account. The only way to have a totally clean sport is if the players are trusted. The events of the last few weeks have thown snooker into a spin. IF you don't or can't trust the participants...then unfortunately you won't be able to trust nor enjoy the sport. Dont allow one or two bad apples cloud the issue and make out that the sport is rotten. 90% plus of all competitors are genuine and try their upmost in every event. You will get cheats in EVERY single sport, fom the highest level down to the lowest game of tiddlewinks in schools if you only concentrate on the negative headlines and forget all the positive things that have passed then you may as well give up on the sport and find another hobby.


impossible to police maybe but players know if they are caught no use crying over spilt milk they know the rules so they live and die by that then.

there are always that one jealous person that will shop you to the authorities....

the biggest problem with this is the top of the sport is accused of cheating so every other player who has more reason to parakeet than john ever has is being dragged through the mud face down.

Re: Snooker players to be banned from all bettings

Postby NedB-H

wildJONESEYE wrote:
the biggest problem with this is the top of the sport is accused of cheating so every other player who has more reason to parakeet than john ever has is being dragged through the mud face down.

interesting comments about the "insurance bets" and how "everyone does it".... would be interested to know JohnfromLondonTown's views on that

Re: Snooker players to be banned from all bettings

Postby Monique

I don't think "everyone does it". In fact I have good reasons to know some players are "trusted" by the bookies (and the authorities) and some aren't, usually because there have been suspicious behaviours/results in the past. And as I already said the public perception of the players is not necessary aligned with what is known or suspected backstage. Quite the opposite sometimes.

Re: Snooker players to be banned from all bettings

Postby Wildey

in my opinion champions shouldn't even think what if i lost. champions should be so single minded nothing else comes in to their thoughts apart from WIN WIN WIN and WIN again.

that is whats shocking .

if john with his pedigree does it if he did it.... it could be a bigger problam than many think with family or friends putting on bets for them.........dont know about anyone else but the only thing i can think of is HOW PATHETIC they must be to do that.

Re: Snooker players to be banned from all bettings

Postby JohnFromLondonTown

NedB-H wrote:interesting comments about the "insurance bets" and how "everyone does it".... would be interested to know JohnfromLondonTown's views on that

Not too sure about the "everyone does it" bit but to keep the game clean, banning players from any sort of betting needs to be put in place.

Re: Snooker players to be banned from all bettings

Postby paperbackwriter

Monique wrote: And as I already said the public perception of the players is not necessary aligned with what is known or suspected backstage. Quite the opposite sometimes.


That doesn't surprise me- it always amazes me how people get suspicious after simplest but at the same time most obvious mistakes of top players. Someone who was so expierenced at whole betting against himself thing (or any other illegal stuff) wouldn't act so foolishly and make people doubt him.

wildJONESEYE wrote:in my opinion champions shouldn't even think what if i lost. champions should be so single minded nothing else comes in to their thoughts apart from WIN WIN WIN and WIN again.

that is whats shocking .

if john with his pedigree does it if he did it.... it could be a bigger problam than many think with family or friends putting on bets for them.........dont know about anyone else but the only thing i can think of is HOW PATHETIC they must be to do that.


I agree... But I still find it unlikely that John did it- this story (I mean, the one about betting against himself) is just too weird and there're so many ambiguities. And well, if he has really lacked this true champion's spirit for all these years, he did good job hiding it.
Still, unfortunately, right now it seems more possible than ever that he has some ignoble secrets. Though I still hope that all he should be ashamed of is naivety.

I also think that banning players from all bettings will have it's effect. Of course it won't make it impossible for them but they'll feel less secure (especially after Higgins/Mooney affair- knowing that tabloids look for their revelations everywhere and that even insiders can't be trusted with such matters). And feeling insecure may just destroy the point of betting against themselves (at least for some players- but it'll be a success nevertheless) since it's meant to take the pressure off them, not to add it.

Re: Snooker players to be banned from all bettings

Postby Wildey

cant agree more paperbackwriter when i first saw the story it was so out of character of the man i know... the guy that during 2009 put his heart and sole in to beating Cope then Selby why would he even think of this. but as monique said theres things in players make up we just don't know about so if this is true Ive never known what makes the real John Higgins Tick.

Re: Snooker players to be banned from all bettings

Postby Casey

You kind of wonder about this now. When this story about the cover bet broke I didn't believe it as the witnesses statement was very sketchy. However this should have been very easy for John to disprove, a week is plenty of time however we have heard nothing.

Disproving this story would have gone a long way to discrediting the NOTW's story also, John really needs to get out in the media with something substantial.

Re: Snooker players to be banned from all bettings

Postby JohnFromLondonTown

case_master wrote:You kind of wonder about this now. When this story about the cover bet broke I didn't believe it as the witnesses statement was very sketchy. However this should have been very easy for John to disprove, a week is plenty of time however we have heard nothing.

Disproving this story would have gone a long way to discrediting the NOTW's story also, John really needs to get out in the media with something substantial.

He'll be getting legal advice case, plenty of it, & they'll tell him how best to play this one out I would have thought.

Re: Snooker players to be banned from all bettings

Postby Wildey

Great point case but as john sais who knows how the legal system works.

im in the process of selling a house im ready to sell the seller cant wait to get things moving but the legal system is holding everything back <doh>

Re: Snooker players to be banned from all bettings

Postby Monique

True about legal advice. But I'm still puzzled that John hasn't denied the betting at all, or did I miss something? (being in Greece ;) ). He vigourously denied the match fixing immediately ...

Re: Snooker players to be banned from all bettings

Postby Wildey

Monique wrote:True about legal advice. But I'm still puzzled that John hasn't denied the betting at all, or did I miss something? (being in Greece ;) ). He vigourously denied the match fixing immediately ...


when the News of The World approached the subject with him in a interview he said NO COMMENT. not sure how to take that if im honest.

Re: Snooker players to be banned from all bettings

Postby Wildey

Sonny wrote:If I was him I wouldn't speak to those scumbags either.

yup but he was talking about match fixing claims then he clammed up ?

was that because he did it or on legal advice to not speak about stuff he didn't know about.

Re: Snooker players to be banned from all bettings

Postby Wildey

Sonny wrote:I haven't seen what you're referring to...


Higgins denied reports he had been on the brink of taking his own life, saying his family had helped him to cope. "I certainly wasn't suicidal," he insisted. Asked if tears were shed, he replied: "Of course there were - lots of them. If I'm being honest there was a whole mix of emotions. It has been tough, it really has been tough."


But Higgins suddenly clammed up when we asked him about our new discovery of his attempt to bet against himself. He gave no reaction and looked at his lawyer Philip Rodney, of Burness solicitors, who said: "This is news to me. I have no knowledge of this. We can get you a statement on this."


Higgins' spokesman said: "We have to discuss this and get back to you." An hour later the spokesman called our reporter with the response: "No comment."


http://www.newsoftheworld.co.uk/news/80 ... nship.html

Re: Snooker players to be banned from all bettings

Postby JohnFromLondonTown

wildJONESEYE wrote:
Sonny wrote:If I was him I wouldn't speak to those scumbags either.

yup but he was talking about match fixing claims then he clammed up ?


Clammed up being NOTW's words. Talk about spin. <doh>

It further reads in the next sentence that 'He gave no reaction'.
In context, he was giving an interview since they first put this into the public domain & then dropped this bomb shell on him during this same interview. He's hardly going to comment on it having not read & with this being the first he's heard of it now is he. Give the guy a break. He hasn't been found guilty of buck all yet.