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Mark Selby: Where is it going wrong ?

Postby Bourne

Firstly no-one should doubt whatsoever the guy has the game to win whatever he wants, he was breaking records aplenty this week, showing no mercy on the table in the opening rounds, he's been one of the most consistent performers this season with finals in Germany and China and qualifying for the PTC Finals etc etc ...
BUT
Why can't he translate them into wins ? Is it as easy to say that he hasn't got the bottle or are is it not a coincidence to say that his opponent just manages to play better on the day than him often, because that was definitely the case in this quarter-final defeat to Ding, he was beaten by the better player.
Is it a case of Selby needing one good run at a tournament where his draw opens up right the way through and he gets a win which will open the floodgates for him ?
Do you think Selby will ever fulfill his potential ?

Re: Mark Selby: Where is it going wrong ?

Postby Roland

He's got something to build on for next season. I think he'll pick up at least 2 ranking tournaments next season and if he can just not put so much pressure on himself to do well at the Crucible and play his natural game then he'll still have at least 5 more realistic chances at the holy grail.

Re: Mark Selby: Where is it going wrong ?

Postby Caledonian Craig

The question is though:- What is his potential?

By this I mean should he miss out on a world title in his career it would be no disgrace as look at those snooker players just as highly thought of who never won or are yet to win the sports biggest prize such as Jimmy White, Steven Maguire, Matthew Stevens, James Wattana etc etc

Re: Mark Selby: Where is it going wrong ?

Postby gallantrabbit

Just details in my opinion. The man is on a mission, made a couple of poor choices last night by his own admission and will get there. Few players could have come back from 6-10 the way he did.

Re: Mark Selby: Where is it going wrong ?

Postby onlyevertonjon

I think he goes to negative when good players match him. Its almost the opposite of Murphy whose "self belief" is such he thinks he can go toe to toe with the other guy, when he could do with backing off.

Look at Selby from 10-6 down, he attacked, played positive shots and got it back to 10-all, but I think he takes too much out of himself to win the big ones. I thought it was great what he did with the snookers to win the frame, but maybe the bigger picture is leaving frames like that so the mental energy is still there when required later on in comps.

I'm not sure how good he is really, because I cant think of one match where he has dominated a high class opponent. Hendry doesnt cout these days with that comment, but still that is one of the best displays I've seen. If he could do that against Higgins, Ronnie, Ding and Robbo I would start thinking the guy is the real deal.

Re: Mark Selby: Where is it going wrong ?

Postby Tubberlad

Okay, there's little doubt that Selby is at least very good, but there's a fact in all of this: he is SERIOUSLY underachieving.

A big deal was made of Matthew Stevens only winning one ranking title, but that was no surprise looking back as the guy really lacked a killer instinct. The question is, does Selby have it?

His game is normally solid under pressure actually, so it's hard to call him a bottler. However, there's a serious problem in taking a few necessary risks and actually going for the jugular. I think he LOOKS a better player than Neil Robertson, but in terms of pacing yourself for a tournament and above all finishing the job, he is miles behind him. When Robertson sees blood, he'll finish the job and go in for the kill. Selby seems to wait around waiting for someone to arrive with a gun, turns his back and leaves the animal walk off.

Is he too negative? I wouldn't have said so, but then again I haven't seen him play to win, rather he plays to avoid losing, unless he's up against O'Sullivan. It was such a pity he lost a ranking final very unfortunately despite playing out of his skin and doing everything right, because he'll probably go more into his shell than ever now.

Will he be a World Champion? It pains me to say this, but I doubt it.

Re: Mark Selby: Where is it going wrong ?

Postby onlyevertonjon

Tubberlad wrote:Okay, there's little doubt that Selby is at least very good, but there's a fact in all of this: he is SERIOUSLY underachieving.

A big deal was made of Matthew Stevens only winning one ranking title, but that was no surprise looking back as the guy really lacked a killer instinct. The question is, does Selby have it?

His game is normally solid under pressure actually, so it's hard to call him a bottler. However, there's a serious problem in taking a few necessary risks and actually going for the jugular. I think he LOOKS a better player than Neil Robertson, but in terms of pacing yourself for a tournament and above all finishing the job, he is miles behind him. When Robertson sees blood, he'll finish the job and go in for the kill. Selby seems to wait around waiting for someone to arrive with a gun, turns his back and leaves the animal walk off.

Is he too negative? I wouldn't have said so, but then again I haven't seen him play to win, rather he plays to avoid losing, unless he's up against O'Sullivan. It was such a pity he lost a ranking final very unfortunately despite playing out of his skin and doing everything right, because he'll probably go more into his shell than ever now.

Will he be a World Champion? It pains me to say this, but I doubt it.



my egg on face prediction is safe for another year.

That is negative IMO. Totally different scenario but that is like Mourinho last night playing not to concede. In snooker there has to be a winner so trying to avoid getting beaten rather than winning only gets you so far.

Re: Mark Selby: Where is it going wrong ?

Postby Tubberlad

Yes, I agree, that is negative thinking, and he does seem to into his shell more for bigger games, unless up against O'Sullivan for some reason.

Re: Mark Selby: Where is it going wrong ?

Postby onlyevertonjon

Tubberlad wrote:Yes, I agree, that is negative thinking, and he does seem to into his shell more for bigger games, unless up against O'Sullivan for some reason.



Maybe because he has figured the way to beat Ronnie is to take it too him in a controlled manner, ala Higgins. I think Selby knows he has the game to beat Ronnie, whereas Shaun Murphy tries to play in the same manner.

This lead to my point, I think Im right in saying that Selby has only ever beaten Ronnie when its gone to the last frame or by 2. I think he needs wins of the 13-8 type against players like that before he is considered a great player.

Maybe his Masters record is overrating him a bit. I always felt Paul Hunter would never win a Worlds or UK and was just a Wembley specialist.

Re: Mark Selby: Where is it going wrong ?

Postby GJ

its all about titles i could go on about how much stevens has under achieved but its all about winning at the end of the day

Selby just cant pace himself right at the worlds and doesnt seem to address the issue

Re: Mark Selby: Where is it going wrong ?

Postby Wildey

Tubberlad wrote:Yes, I agree, that is negative thinking, and he does seem to into his shell more for bigger games, unless up against O'Sullivan for some reason.

he gets up for Hendry aswell then flops..

as a Hendry and Selby fan that's frustrating but lets not forget how well Ding played that's been ignored and more talk of Selby flopping.

yes he did not play as well as he did against hendry especially the first session that was dyre stuff after a brilliant century start from him but some of the ding safeties was outstanding in the match and matched him toe to toe that it did force mistakes from him...

Re: Mark Selby: Where is it going wrong ?

Postby Tubberlad

I think Hunter was a better player than Selby, he had three ranking titles on the board to go with those Masters, people forget that. Now, whether he would have won a World or UK is up to anyone now unfortunately, I think he would have because he was beating big players and winning titles, unlike Selby.

A great sadness that we'll never get that answer.

Re: Mark Selby: Where is it going wrong ?

Postby Wildey

Tubberlad wrote:I think Hunter was a better player than Selby, he had three ranking titles on the board to go with those Masters, people forget that. Now, whether he would have won a World or UK is up to anyone now unfortunately, I think he would have because he was beating big players and winning titles, unlike Selby.

A great sadness that we'll never get that answer.

Hunter when under pressure went on the attack very similar to Ronnie and Hendry.

i think if Selby adopted that tact more he would get more success.

yes sometimes you got to grind it out and had Ronnie or Hendry done that they could have won more who knows ??

Re: Mark Selby: Where is it going wrong ?

Postby GJ

Selby should played at 60 or 70 % agianst hendo instead of playing at his best it backfired as he had a let down in the quarters

he needs to steadily improve in majors and not peak in round 2

Re: Mark Selby: Where is it going wrong ?

Postby Wildey

GJ wrote:Selby should played at 60 or 70 % agianst hendo instead of playing at his best it backfired as he had a let down in the quarters

he needs to steadily improve in majors and not peak in round 2

there's no %% gage when you out there lol

you just play the table and pot the balls

Re: Mark Selby: Where is it going wrong ?

Postby GJ

Wild wrote:
GJ wrote:Selby should played at 60 or 70 % agianst hendo instead of playing at his best it backfired as he had a let down in the quarters

he needs to steadily improve in majors and not peak in round 2

there's no %% gage when you out there lol

you just play the table and pot the balls



Mate he seems to keep faltering so i may not be to far off the mark

look at say higgins he was poor early on but plays well when he had to and just did enough

Selby should take note of that

Re: Mark Selby: Where is it going wrong ?

Postby Wildey

ill tell you what though John Higgins was guilty of that at one point in his career.

in 1999 John was by far the best player that year in the early rounds. he just swatted players for fun losing just 12 frames in 3 rounds then he faced Williams and he took him apart in the semis 17-10.

Re: Mark Selby: Where is it going wrong ?

Postby GJ

Wild wrote:ill tell you what though John Higgins was guilty of that at one point in his career.

in 1999 John was by far the best player that year in the early rounds. he just swatted players for fun losing just 12 frames in 3 rounds then he faced Williams and he took him apart in the semis 17-10.



he learn though thats the key

selby has plenty of time but he needs to learn from his mistakes

Re: Mark Selby: Where is it going wrong ?

Postby Bourne

Maybe he goes out mentally to be a bit too ruthless early in tournaments, like against Hendry where he played on for four snookers, yes I love that mentality that he wants to every frame but if you scratch under the surface you see someone there who doesn't want to lose and is desperate to do anything possible to hold a lead so whenever a player in good/better form comes up against him, his head gets a bit mixed up as to what to do to counter it.

Re: Mark Selby: Where is it going wrong ?

Postby Wildey

Bourne wrote:Maybe he goes out mentally to be a bit too ruthless early in tournaments, like against Hendry where he played on for four snookers, yes I love that mentality that he wants to every frame but if you scratch under the surface you see someone there who doesn't want to lose and is desperate to do anything possible to hold a lead so whenever a player in good/better form comes up against him, his head gets a bit mixed up as to what to do to counter it.

good point

he was in such a cocoon of concentration for 3 sessions.

was that really necessarily against Stephen ?

he could have afforded to miss a hell of a lot of pots and still win maybe 13-9.

yes Stephen is a dangerous player at the crucible but selby could have had more in reserve if needed in the 3rd session.

Re: Mark Selby: Where is it going wrong ?

Postby GJ

Wild wrote:
Bourne wrote:Maybe he goes out mentally to be a bit too ruthless early in tournaments, like against Hendry where he played on for four snookers, yes I love that mentality that he wants to every frame but if you scratch under the surface you see someone there who doesn't want to lose and is desperate to do anything possible to hold a lead so whenever a player in good/better form comes up against him, his head gets a bit mixed up as to what to do to counter it.

good point

he was in such a cocoon of concentration for 3 sessions.

was that really necessarily against Stephen ?

he could have afforded to miss a hell of a lot of pots and still win maybe 13-9.

yes Stephen is a dangerous player at the crucible but selby could have had more in reserve if needed in the 3rd session.



:hatoff:

Re: Mark Selby: Where is it going wrong ?

Postby GJ

Wild

Look at ding eh was gping through the motion abit agianst binghma but stepped it up when he had to

Selby for me would have beaten hendo easily without putting so much in to it

Re: Mark Selby: Where is it going wrong ?

Postby Bourne

Tubberlad wrote:I think Hunter was a better player than Selby, he had three ranking titles on the board to go with those Masters, people forget that. Now, whether he would have won a World or UK is up to anyone now unfortunately, I think he would have because he was beating big players and winning titles, unlike Selby.

A great sadness that we'll never get that answer.

I always feel a bit guilty thinking waht might have happened with Paul because we will ultimately never know but one thing I can't ignore is the 03 semi-final and how he ended up losing that, yes Ken was playing utterly inspiring stuff but if you put Paul back in a future worlds semi or final, would he still have had those demons ? As I say we'll never know but he is still truly missed not just as a snooker player but as a really nice person <ok>

Re: Mark Selby: Where is it going wrong ?

Postby Wildey

GJ wrote:Wild

Look at ding eh was gping through the motion abit agianst binghma but stepped it up when he had to

Selby for me would have beaten hendo easily without putting so much in to it

yes looking back i can think of only 1 easy pot hendry missed in the whole match and that was in the final frame hendry made the most of every scoring chance he had and he still got thumped just shows how dominant and in the zone Selby was when he really no need to be im sure stephen would have missed a hell of a lot more than that if he was in more often <laugh>

Re: Mark Selby: Where is it going wrong ?

Postby Snooker Overdrive

Selby did this year nearly the same thing he did one year ago. Played brilliantly in his previous match but than lost as the favourite after an only half successful comeback.

I have the impression every time Selby loses such an important match, he came up against an incredible good opponent. If he plays Ronnie he adapts to that well and raises his game also. But against other top players he just seems to fold in these situations and comes up short in the end.

He won 2 masters and that's the 3. most important title the game has to offer. But time is running out and he's not getting younger. I don't think he'll see his season as a success even though he made very many points in the rankings. He had disappointments at the UK and the WC but worst of all also lost his incredible Masters record in the very first round against Mark King.

He lost two ranking finals made quite a comeback in both of them, but like so often close but no cigar. I don't like the word underachiever because he call so many players that it became ridiculous. If so many players underachieves maybe the measure is too high.

I think Selby will be at the end of his career in one line with the likes of Stephen Maguire, Stephen Lee and Ali Carter.
Last edited by Snooker Overdrive on 28 Apr 2011, edited 1 time in total.