Is footage of the 1981 WC final totally lost?

I want to watch the supposed re-rack with just blue, pink and black remaining, but there seems to be no footage of it whatsoever.

How can it just become totally lost? Snooker was a very popular sport at the time and home-video recorders were already common.

Did the re-rack with just blue, pink and black actually happen? Or is it just an urban legend?

It is not totally lost. I have a DVD of the final which is around 3-4 hours long, recorded by somebody at the time and transferred.

However, there wasn’t blanket live coverage of the final back then. Although the BBC would have taped it all, what they showed was still, largely, in edited format. Other posters such as BadTemperedCyril or EmpireStateHuman will probably know better than me, but I imagine very few of the 30 frames were shown live or in their entirety.

I think someone recorded over the whole championship with episodes of He Man

video recorders were common place in '81?

Dan-cat wrote:video recorders were common place in '81?

I wouldn’t say commonplace, but they were certainly starting to become more of a thing in people’s houses; my dad got our first around this time, a top loader that weighed about 50kgs, paid on the monthly from Radio Rentals

SnookerEd25 wrote:It is not totally lost. I have a DVD of the final which is around 3-4 hours long, recorded by somebody at the time and transferred.

However, there wasn’t blanket live coverage of the final back then. Although the BBC would have taped it all, what they showed was still, largely, in edited format. Other posters such as BadTemperedCyril or EmpireStateHuman will probably know better than me, but I imagine very few of the 30 frames were shown live or in their entirety.

That's interesting. Does your DVD include any footage of the alleged re-rack?

The re-rack happened in frame 8.

The footage I've seen is entirely of day 2, except for one frame broadcast in the 1981 annual review (frame 6 which put Davis 6-0 up).

Incidentally, there was a re-rack with just pink and black left - Selt v Wakelin. https://twitter.com/davehendon/status/1 ... 6424785926

Temujin wrote:

SnookerEd25 wrote:It is not totally lost. I have a DVD of the final which is around 3-4 hours long, recorded by somebody at the time and transferred.

However, there wasn’t blanket live coverage of the final back then. Although the BBC would have taped it all, what they showed was still, largely, in edited format. Other posters such as BadTemperedCyril or EmpireStateHuman will probably know better than me, but I imagine very few of the 30 frames were shown live or in their entirety.

That's interesting. Does your DVD include any footage of the alleged re-rack?

I didn’t think so, though haven’t watched it for a while. I’m sure it would have stuck in my mind though. But, like ESH says, I think it is all day 2 coverage in any case.

Empire State Human wrote:Incidentally, there was a re-rack with just pink and black left - Selt v Wakelin. https://twitter.com/davehendon/status/1 ... 6424785926

Looks like Trump & Wells to me…

There was a re-rack around 5 or 6 years ago in qualifying for something; the frame had already been in play for nearly an hour when the colours went very tricky around one pocket. Alan McManus was certainly one of the players involved. I watched it at the time but can’t remember who the other one was.

Help, ESH?

Think it was possibly only blue, pink, black on then, too…

SnookerEd25 wrote:

Empire State Human wrote:Incidentally, there was a re-rack with just pink and black left - Selt v Wakelin. https://twitter.com/davehendon/status/1 ... 6424785926

Looks like Trump & Wells to me…

There was a re-rack around 5 or 6 years ago in qualifying for something; the frame had already been in play for nearly an hour when the colours went very tricky around one pocket. Alan McManus was certainly one of the players involved. I watched it at the time but can’t remember who the other one was.

Help, ESH?

The photo is Trump v Wells. Not sure how much of Hendon's comments are showing, but that one wasn't a stalemate in the end because Wells eventually knocked the black in. Hendon mentioned the Selt v Wakelin game because, in contrast, that one did end in stalemate. No pictures of that, however. Possibly untelevised.


No idea about the McManus game.

Maybe McManusFan knows.

If he doesn’t, I may have to petition the Mods for a name-change

Empire State Human wrote:Incidentally, there was a re-rack with just pink and black left - Selt v Wakelin. https://twitter.com/davehendon/status/1 ... 6424785926

Is there any footage of that?

Alex0paul wrote:I think someone recorded over the whole championship with episodes of He Man

SnookerFan wrote:

Alex0paul wrote:I think someone recorded over the whole championship with episodes of He Man

I believe that was Joe Johnson… He had some friends round and they asked if they could see some footage of his final against Steve Davis. When he put the tape in they were greeted by “the Power of Greyskull”!

I’ve never seen footage of the ‘81 re-rack. It was quite common for the BBC to reuse video tape in those days as it was apparently quite expensive and took up space in their archives. So very often the only footage available is that which people have recorded on their old Betamax or VHS.

badtemperedcyril wrote:I’ve never seen footage of the ‘81 re-rack. It was quite common for the BBC to reuse video tape in those days as it was apparently quite expensive and took up space in their archives. So very often the only footage available is that which people have recorded on their old Betamax or VHS.

If anyone had recorded it, how could it be found?

There is a website called "the lost media wiki" that documents missing pieces of media, maybe it could be found if it was entered there?

badtemperedcyril wrote:

SnookerFan wrote:

Alex0paul wrote:I think someone recorded over the whole championship with episodes of He Man

I believe that was Joe Johnson… He had some friends round and they asked if they could see some footage of his final against Steve Davis. When he put the tape in they were greeted by “the Power of Greyskull”!

Yeah, it was Joe Johnson.

Temujin wrote:

badtemperedcyril wrote:I’ve never seen footage of the ‘81 re-rack. It was quite common for the BBC to reuse video tape in those days as it was apparently quite expensive and took up space in their archives. So very often the only footage available is that which people have recorded on their old Betamax or VHS.

If anyone had recorded it, how could it be found?

There is a website called "the lost media wiki" that documents missing pieces of media, maybe it could be found if it was entered there?

The re-rack incident was shown on the first day of the final in the 5.40pm broadcast but they only showed around 5 minutes of the re-rack. I know someone that has the footage but as it's only 5 minutes it isn't really something to get overly excited about.

TrevSS wrote:

Temujin wrote:

badtemperedcyril wrote:I’ve never seen footage of the ‘81 re-rack. It was quite common for the BBC to reuse video tape in those days as it was apparently quite expensive and took up space in their archives. So very often the only footage available is that which people have recorded on their old Betamax or VHS.

If anyone had recorded it, how could it be found?

There is a website called "the lost media wiki" that documents missing pieces of media, maybe it could be found if it was entered there?

The re-rack incident was shown on the first day of the final in the 5.40pm broadcast but they only showed around 5 minutes of the re-rack. I know someone that has the footage but as it's only 5 minutes it isn't really something to get overly excited about.

If they have the footage, can't they upload it to Youtube? Or sell a copy to someone who can?

It's a very very rare occurrence in snooker to have a re-rack that late in a frame. It surely would be a very popular video.

Temujin wrote:

TrevSS wrote:

Temujin wrote:

badtemperedcyril wrote:I’ve never seen footage of the ‘81 re-rack. It was quite common for the BBC to reuse video tape in those days as it was apparently quite expensive and took up space in their archives. So very often the only footage available is that which people have recorded on their old Betamax or VHS.

If anyone had recorded it, how could it be found?

There is a website called "the lost media wiki" that documents missing pieces of media, maybe it could be found if it was entered there?

The re-rack incident was shown on the first day of the final in the 5.40pm broadcast but they only showed around 5 minutes of the re-rack. I know someone that has the footage but as it's only 5 minutes it isn't really something to get overly excited about.

If they have the footage, can't they upload it to Youtube? Or sell a copy to someone who can?

It's a very very rare occurrence in snooker to have a re-rack that late in a frame. It surely would be a very popular video.

It may well get uploaded in the future but that is up to them. As you say it might be a popular video but once it's on youtube it then becomes worthless for any potential swaps. Without going into too much detail there is a large amount of rare stuff among a few collectors but they don't want it uploaded to youtube. In a lot of cases it has been paid for by the individuals obtaining it from discreet sources and therefore they are not going to give it away by uploading it to youtube.

TrevSS wrote:

Temujin wrote:

TrevSS wrote:

Temujin wrote:

badtemperedcyril wrote:I’ve never seen footage of the ‘81 re-rack. It was quite common for the BBC to reuse video tape in those days as it was apparently quite expensive and took up space in their archives. So very often the only footage available is that which people have recorded on their old Betamax or VHS.

If anyone had recorded it, how could it be found?

There is a website called "the lost media wiki" that documents missing pieces of media, maybe it could be found if it was entered there?

The re-rack incident was shown on the first day of the final in the 5.40pm broadcast but they only showed around 5 minutes of the re-rack. I know someone that has the footage but as it's only 5 minutes it isn't really something to get overly excited about.

If they have the footage, can't they upload it to Youtube? Or sell a copy to someone who can?

It's a very very rare occurrence in snooker to have a re-rack that late in a frame. It surely would be a very popular video.

It may well get uploaded in the future but that is up to them. As you say it might be a popular video but once it's on youtube it then becomes worthless for any potential swaps. Without going into too much detail there is a large amount of rare stuff among a few collectors but they don't want it uploaded to youtube. In a lot of cases it has been paid for by the individuals obtaining it from discreet sources and therefore they are not going to give it away by uploading it to youtube.

Do you have any idea how much he might want for the footage?

Also, why does it matter if you name which rare footage is the hands of collectors? It wouldn't affect them, but it would be good to know that it at least wasn't lost to history and may one day become available to see again.

Are these collectors only interested in swaps? Or would they perhaps be willing to sell the footage?

Is there a collector out there who has footage of Johnny Bravo in action?

To cut a long story short, I will speak to them about the re-rack frame, but what I've found with people is that sometimes they say I'll do this and this etc, and 6 months down the line they don't deliver.

As for selling and swapping stuff, it can vary. For instance there was a chap who had a vast collection of stuff that he sold to people for years but he no longer does it due to ill health. ITV used to sell 1.5 hours of footage at a cost of £155 with a huge watermark across the screen. They would only allow up to 3 matches though. As far as I know they don't offer this service anymore.

Sorry I can't be more helpful but it is what it is unfortunately. Enjoy life, it doesn't last long and in my opinion it isn't worth wasting too much time on looking for old footage. All the best

Holden Chinaski wrote:Is there a collector out there who has footage of Johnny Bravo in action?

I think Cartoon Network owns the archive footage.