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Re: World Championship qualifiers

Postby Wildey

Dan-cat wrote:I'm surprised at you Wildey, saying it should be called off if it can't be best of 19s. Players' livelihoods at stake. It means that the lower ranked players might be able to eat this summer.

The World Championship shouldnt be a welphare initiative its the no 1 event in the sport.


Play Tournaments by all means but why use the World Championship as a meal ticket for players.

Re: World Championship qualifiers

Postby SnookerEd25

I tend to agree with Wildey as above. If the WC cannot be run as it normally would, with a full (or near-full) complement of players, then scrap it and, by all means, replace it with a similar format but with a different event title.

However, playing Devil's Advocate, perhaps the drawback with that would be due to the terms of the sponsorship deal and TV contract; if it is not the 'World Championship' - even in name only - then that money possibly drops off, and there is no plan B - IE, no tournament at all - so no earning potential for any of the players, referees, commentators, officials etc.

To utilise the sponsorship money, the TV money, and any other revenue accrued then this may have to go ahead as the 'world championship', even though most of us know it isn't (at least in the regularly accepted use of the term).

Re: World Championship qualifiers

Postby Alex0paul

I think best of 11s is fine for this year as a one off. I really don’t think it will revert to that annually except maybe Round 1 for the no hopers

Re: World Championship qualifiers

Postby lhpirnie

SnookerEd25 wrote:I tend to agree with Wildey as above. If the WC cannot be run as it normally would, with a full (or near-full) complement of players, then scrap it and, by all means, replace it with a similar format but with a different event title.

However, playing Devil's Advocate, perhaps the drawback with that would be due to the terms of the sponsorship deal and TV contract; if it is not the 'World Championship' - even in name only - then that money possibly drops off, and there is no plan B - IE, no tournament at all - so no earning potential for any of the players, referees, commentators, officials etc.

To utilise the sponsorship money, the TV money, and any other revenue accrued then this may have to go ahead as the 'world championship', even though most of us know it isn't (at least in the regularly accepted use of the term).

I don't know the exact terms, but it's probably £5-10 million loss if they cancel the 'World Championship'.


WST would look pretty incompetent if they couldn't organise a snooker tournament when other sports are going ahead in some form (e.g. Premiership football). Especially after the relative success of the Covid Classic last week.

An alternative to help players financially would be to hand out a fixed sum. But that really would be welfare, rather than allowing players to compete as they have signed-up to do.

Does it count as a 'proper' World Championship? To 99% of people watching on BBC they will hardly notice the difference, except for obvious Covid measures. Our opinions aren't necessarily more important than theirs just because we follow the game more closesly.

Re: World Championship qualifiers

Postby Ck147

SnookerFan wrote:Let's just make it Shoot-Out rules, play it over a weekend.

+1

Re: World Championship qualifiers

Postby D4P

lhpirnie wrote:Does it count as a 'proper' World Championship?


For at least some people, whether it "counts" or not will depend on who wins. If they like the winner, then it counts; if they don't like the winner, then it doesn't count.

Re: World Championship qualifiers

Postby lhpirnie

D4P wrote:
lhpirnie wrote:Does it count as a 'proper' World Championship?


For at least some people, whether it "counts" or not will depend on who wins. If they like the winner, then it counts; if they don't like the winner, then it doesn't count.

Yes, probably true. But we will always remember the pictures of the guy holding the trophy on 16th August, and the BBC will keep showing them.

Re: World Championship qualifiers

Postby Holden Chinaski

D4P wrote:
lhpirnie wrote:Does it count as a 'proper' World Championship?


For at least some people, whether it "counts" or not will depend on who wins. If they like the winner, then it counts; if they don't like the winner, then it doesn't count.

You know the Island well.

Re: World Championship qualifiers

Postby Ck147

lhpirnie wrote:
D4P wrote:
lhpirnie wrote:Does it count as a 'proper' World Championship?


For at least some people, whether it "counts" or not will depend on who wins. If they like the winner, then it counts; if they don't like the winner, then it doesn't count.

Yes, probably true. But we will always remember the pictures of the guy holding the trophy on 16th August, and the BBC will keep showing them.

Pink won't stop reminding us either as it will be Ding. #dingwc2020

Re: World Championship qualifiers

Postby Andre147

D4P wrote:
lhpirnie wrote:Does it count as a 'proper' World Championship?


For at least some people, whether it "counts" or not will depend on who wins. If they like the winner, then it counts; if they don't like the winner, then it doesn't count.


It won't help matters if somebody wins it for the first time. There will always be people claiming he won it due to the special circumstances. If another player wins it who has done it before, then that silly excuse wont work because he won it under normal conditions.

Re: World Championship qualifiers

Postby SnookerEd25

OK, so Ding will just have to win this year, then break the Crucible Curse ‘under normal conditions’ & all doubters will be silenced.

Simples.

Re: World Championship qualifiers

Postby Wildey

lhpirnie wrote:
SnookerEd25 wrote:I tend to agree with Wildey as above. If the WC cannot be run as it normally would, with a full (or near-full) complement of players, then scrap it and, by all means, replace it with a similar format but with a different event title.

However, playing Devil's Advocate, perhaps the drawback with that would be due to the terms of the sponsorship deal and TV contract; if it is not the 'World Championship' - even in name only - then that money possibly drops off, and there is no plan B - IE, no tournament at all - so no earning potential for any of the players, referees, commentators, officials etc.

To utilise the sponsorship money, the TV money, and any other revenue accrued then this may have to go ahead as the 'world championship', even though most of us know it isn't (at least in the regularly accepted use of the term).

I don't know the exact terms, but it's probably £5-10 million loss if they cancel the 'World Championship'.


WST would look pretty incompetent if they couldn't organise a snooker tournament when other sports are going ahead in some form (e.g. Premiership football). Especially after the relative success of the Covid Classic last week.

An alternative to help players financially would be to hand out a fixed sum. But that really would be welfare, rather than allowing players to compete as they have signed-up to do.

Does it count as a 'proper' World Championship? To 99% of people watching on BBC they will hardly notice the difference, except for obvious Covid measures. Our opinions aren't necessarily more important than theirs just because we follow the game more closesly.

Football though was in the middle of a competition.


And more than any other tournament you will notice the difference No MC, No Walk On Music, No Applause, you can feel the crowd at the crucible while watching on TV the atmosphere is electric normally and the crowd causes that so it will be noticed on TV alright.

Re: World Championship qualifiers

Postby Wildey

boris_the_butcher wrote:Cancel the qualifiers, just take the 32 top ranked players and get on with it.

OK Someone has now put their foot forward with an idea all of a sudden best OF 11 Matches doesn't feel as bad.


That was never going to happen part of the reason they want to play it is to give opportunity to players to play

Re: World Championship qualifiers

Postby Wildey

In an Instagram chat with Hendry last night Ronnie might pull out of the WC depending on protocol he was going bonkers in Milton Keynes, and he won't be happy having to do a lot of testing either 17 days of no running or leaving your room would be too much for him.

Re: World Championship qualifiers

Postby Pink Ball

I’d be inclined to give World Snooker the benefit of the doubt on this one. If this format were carried on for future editions, I would be very unhappy. But this isn’t a normal year.

I know some people have explained (and explained very well) why they can’t see why the qualifiers couldn’t all be best-of-19s this year as well. That’s fine, but we have to go with whatever WST is most comfortable with right now, what they feel will put the tournament proper in the least jeopardy.

At the end of the day, the most important thing of all is that there will be a World Championship, in-house spectators or not. Even if every session at the tournament filled out, the total attendance would still barely break 40,000. Not an insignificant number, but not a staggering one, which suggests to me — if the competition is as crucial to WST’s wellbeing as it seems — that television and other coverage is the main money-spinner. And all we need to do to secure that is make sure the tournament actually bloody takes place.

If that means the qualifiers have to be watered down this year, I’m fine with that. It’s crucial for the game’s future health that the tournament happens. What happens in the qualifiers and what we as anoraks think is not at all crucial.

Re: World Championship qualifiers

Postby Wildey

Pink Ball wrote:I’d be inclined to give World Snooker the benefit of the doubt on this one. If this format were carried on for future editions, I would be very unhappy. But this isn’t a normal year.

I know some people have explained (and explained very well) why they can’t see why the qualifiers couldn’t all be best-of-19s this year as well. That’s fine, but we have to go with whatever WST is most comfortable with right now, what they feel will put the tournament proper in the least jeopardy.

At the end of the day, the most important thing of all is that there will be a World Championship, in-house spectators or not. Even if every session at the tournament filled out, the total attendance would still barely break 40,000. Not an insignificant number, but not a staggering one, which suggests to me — if the competition is as crucial to WST’s wellbeing as it seems — that television and other coverage is the main money-spinner. And all we need to do to secure that is make sure the tournament actually bloody takes place.

If that means the qualifiers have to be watered down this year, I’m fine with that. It’s crucial for the game’s future health that the tournament happens. What happens in the qualifiers and what we as anoraks think is not at all crucial.

i agree all 4 rounds as best of 19 would mean having 14 day qualifying and the expense that would mean. You can't play 3 sessions a day with the amount of players involved at the moment but i think 50/50 would have been much better so that players 17-48 would be coming in at the 3rd round with 2 best of 19 to qualify and all they needed to do was add 2 days and it would be safer as well.. With one session matches you will need 16 refs to ref them per day with best of 19 only 8. which will mean only 24 players and refs on site per day with best of 11s its 48.


Last season you needed 30 frames to qualify this year some will qualify with winning just 16

Re: World Championship qualifiers

Postby The_Abbott

SnookerFan wrote:Let's just make it Shoot-Out rules, play it over a weekend.

Jimmy might just get another chance of the world title

Re: World Championship qualifiers

Postby The_Abbott

Andre147 wrote:
D4P wrote:
lhpirnie wrote:Does it count as a 'proper' World Championship?


For at least some people, whether it "counts" or not will depend on who wins. If they like the winner, then it counts; if they don't like the winner, then it doesn't count.


It won't help matters if somebody wins it for the first time. There will always be people claiming he won it due to the special circumstances. If another player wins it who has done it before, then that silly excuse wont work because he won it under normal conditions.


But then again if Ronnie wins it - has he equalled Steve Davis or not? Some people will say he has others will say he still has 5 plus a mickey mouse WC

I personally have no problem if it means having some snooker back.

Re: World Championship qualifiers

Postby HustleKing

The_Abbott wrote:
SnookerFan wrote:Let's just make it Shoot-Out rules, play it over a weekend.

Jimmy might just get another chance of the world title


Well if they were to do that, they would have to make it considerably harder to win to best befit a WC.

That would mean the final would be at least a best of 5 frames and possibly earlier rounds would require more than one frame to win

Re: World Championship qualifiers

Postby The_Abbott

SnookerEd25 wrote:OK, so Ding will just have to win this year, then break the Crucible Curse ‘under normal conditions’ & all doubters will be silenced.

Simples.


If Judd wins it this year has he really broken the curse or has the virus beaten the curse?

Re: World Championship qualifiers

Postby Wildey

The Biggest concern is Ding Junhui he's already pulled out of one event and you don't want a top 16 player to pull out because of this bucking virus

Re: World Championship qualifiers

Postby Iranu

Wildey wrote:The Biggest concern is Ding Junhui he's already pulled out of one event and you don't want a top 16 player to pull out because of this bucking virus

I was thinking this too. Can’t imagine there’ll be a huge change in circumstances between the end of the TC and the start of the WC.

Re: World Championship qualifiers

Postby lhpirnie

Iranu wrote:
Wildey wrote:The Biggest concern is Ding Junhui he's already pulled out of one event and you don't want a top 16 player to pull out because of this bucking virus

I was thinking this too. Can’t imagine there’ll be a huge change in circumstances between the end of the TC and the start of the WC.

Yes, it is highly possible Ding will be missing. But the BBC are fond of Joe Perry, and there's Yan Bingtao to ensure CCTV5 will broadcast the event in China.


For the 21 players in China (and the 2 in Hong Kong, not counting Marco Fu who is already out) we will have to watch announcements in the next 2 weeks. They have all gone very quiet on social media which is significant.

Re: World Championship qualifiers

Postby KrazeeEyezKilla

Running a World Championship with a significant number of players not able to enter isn't ideal but when those players are the ones who have already had to sacrifice most to become professional Snooker players then it's pretty harsh.

Re: World Championship qualifiers

Postby KrazeeEyezKilla

D4P wrote:
lhpirnie wrote:Does it count as a 'proper' World Championship?


For at least some people, whether it "counts" or not will depend on who wins. If they like the winner, then it counts; if they don't like the winner, then it doesn't count.


It's a bit like the calls to void the Premier League simply because Liverpool were going to win it.


   

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