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Who do you rate as the better player?

Steve Davis
6
30%
John Higgins
14
70%
 
Total votes : 20

Re: Who is the superior player?

Postby Johnny Bravo

Iranu wrote:
Pink Ball wrote:
Johnny Bravo wrote:Higgins is... lightyears in front in terms of safety and tactical play.

What utter horseshit. I would have Higgins and Davis as my top two safety players of all time, and I'd find it very hard to separate them. Up until the mid noughties, a lot of people still felt Davis was arguably the best safety player in the world, and with good reason. I think Higgins and Selby have been better tactical players, but if we're strictly talking safety, Davis is right up there with anyone, and ahead of Selby.

I think Johnny meant lightyears ahead of Hendry.

I’ve always thought Davis was underrated as a breakbuilder, and I only really watched him in his twilight years.


Yes, that's what I meant. :hatoff:

Re: Who is the superior player?

Postby Pink Ball

Johnny Bravo wrote:
Pink Ball wrote:
Johnny Bravo wrote:Higgins is... lightyears in front in terms of safety and tactical play.

What utter horseshit. I would have Higgins and Davis as my top two safety players of all time, and I'd find it very hard to separate them. Up until the mid noughties, a lot of people still felt Davis was arguably the best safety player in the world, and with good reason. I think Higgins and Selby have been better tactical players, but if we're strictly talking safety, Davis is right up there with anyone, and ahead of Selby.


You misunderstood Pinkey.

My point was that Davis got beat by Hendry, who had a one-dimensional game. Hendry was a tremendous potter and breakbuilder, but was an average safety and tactical player. Yet he manged to beat Davis most times simply by out-potting and out-scoring him.

Than I said that Higgins is almost as good a potter and breakbuilder as Hendry, but lightyears in front when it comes to safety and tactical play (compared to Hendry, not to Davis).

Now, since this is about Davis vs Higgins, there isn't a single department of the game where Davis beats Higgins:
- potting - they're about even;
- breakbuilding - Higgins has the edge;
- safety play - again, they're even;
- tactical play - small edge to Higgins.

Fair comment, and my apologies for misunderstanding.

Re: Who is the superior player?

Postby Johnny Bravo

Pink Ball wrote:
Johnny Bravo wrote:
Pink Ball wrote:
Johnny Bravo wrote:Higgins is... lightyears in front in terms of safety and tactical play.

What utter horseshit. I would have Higgins and Davis as my top two safety players of all time, and I'd find it very hard to separate them. Up until the mid noughties, a lot of people still felt Davis was arguably the best safety player in the world, and with good reason. I think Higgins and Selby have been better tactical players, but if we're strictly talking safety, Davis is right up there with anyone, and ahead of Selby.


You misunderstood Pinkey.

My point was that Davis got beat by Hendry, who had a one-dimensional game. Hendry was a tremendous potter and breakbuilder, but was an average safety and tactical player. Yet he manged to beat Davis most times simply by out-potting and out-scoring him.

Than I said that Higgins is almost as good a potter and breakbuilder as Hendry, but lightyears in front when it comes to safety and tactical play (compared to Hendry, not to Davis).

Now, since this is about Davis vs Higgins, there isn't a single department of the game where Davis beats Higgins:
- potting - they're about even;
- breakbuilding - Higgins has the edge;
- safety play - again, they're even;
- tactical play - small edge to Higgins.

Fair comment, and my apologies for misunderstanding.


No problem. :spot on:

Re: Who is the superior player?

Postby Iranu

From what I’ve seen of Hendry I wouldn’t say Higgins was almost as good a potter as him. I don’t think it’s particularly close; it’s easily the weakest part of Higgins’ game in my opinion.

Re: Who is the superior player?

Postby Johnny Bravo

Iranu wrote:From what I’ve seen of Hendry I wouldn’t say Higgins was almost as good a potter as him. I don’t think it’s particularly close; it’s easily the weakest part of Higgins’ game in my opinion.


If we are talking about long pots, I agree.
But most other type of pots, Higgins is close.

Re: Who is the superior player?

Postby HappyCamper

I voted for the Nugget. No idea who the other two intelligent and discriminating individuals are.

Re: Who is the superior player?

Postby Johnny Bravo

Holden Chinaski wrote:
Johnny Bravo wrote:
Dan-cat wrote:three for the nugget!


Higgins will eat him up for breakfast.

One of the best matches of all time:



Even a blind squirrel finds a nut from time to time. When this match took place, Higgins was under serious pressure due to the cheating scandal/allegations.

Re: Who is the superior player?

Postby SnookerFan

Johnny Bravo wrote:
Dan-cat wrote:three for the nugget!


Higgins will eat him up for breakfast.


Not if Stephen Lee gets their first.

Re: Who is the superior player?

Postby Badsnookerplayer

Johnny Bravo wrote:
Holden Chinaski wrote:
Johnny Bravo wrote:
Dan-cat wrote:three for the nugget!


Higgins will eat him up for breakfast.

One of the best matches of all time:



Even a blind squirrel finds a nut from time to time. When this match took place, Higgins was under serious pressure due to the cheating scandal/allegations.

It was an enthralling match, but Higgins would normally have one it at a canter

Re: Who is the superior player?

Postby SnookerFan

Johnny Bravo wrote:One of the best matches of all time:



Even a blind squirrel finds a nut from time to time. When this match took place, Higgins was under serious pressure due to the cheating scandal/allegations.[/quote]

What you on about? No he wasn't.

The incident in Poland didn't even happen until a few days after this match.

Re: Who is the superior player?

Postby SnookerFan

Holden Chinaski wrote:
Johnny Bravo wrote:
Dan-cat wrote:three for the nugget!


Higgins will eat him up for breakfast.

One of the best matches of all time:



I was willing Davis to win that.

I kept hiding my head behind a pillow, I was so nervous.

Re: Who is the superior player?

Postby SnookerFan

Comparing eras is difficult.

Because, yes the era that Davis dominated in was weaker than the one Higgins played in. But also, they played a completely different style in those days. Alex Higgins was the only one who was consistently trying to play the exciting, big break stuff. In those days, they didn't try a pot unless it was close to 100% it would go in. It was expected there'd be a lot more safety tactical play. Whereas a lot of players now use that as their b-game if their potting isn't there.

I will say that my gut feeling is that Higgins was a better player. Definitely more complete. But we don't know what Steve Davis would've been like if he came 10, 15, 20 years later. He'd have been raised and taught to play a different style of game to the one he needed in the 1980s. Who knows how good he would've been?

Re: Who is the superior player?

Postby Badsnookerplayer

Steve would have been successful in any era IMO.

He had a superior work ethic to nearly any player, and he would have thrived on better tables. It is too easy to write off players from earlier eras.

By the time he played Higgins, he was well past his best and Johnny may have a point if Higgins knew that the rubbish was about to hit the fan.

Re: Who is the superior player?

Postby SnookerFan

Badsnookerplayer wrote:Steve would have been successful in any era IMO.

He had a superior work ethic to nearly any player, and he would have thrived on better tables. It is too easy to write off players from earlier eras.

By the time he played Higgins, he was well past his best and Johnny may have a point if Higgins knew that the rubbish was about to hit the fan.


But, did he?

Like I say, the incident didn't happen to a couple of days after this. And had he won, he probably wouldn't even have attended.

Re: Who is the superior player?

Postby TheSaviour

John Higgins certainly has plan A and plan B. And that´s always going to be something I really appreciate. No systematic person can miss both of those plans, if possessing those. But those plans needs to be the opposite ones, and build systematically. But if that´s the case, then certainy, yes! Can miss once, but never miss twice.

Obviously there can be persons who doesn´t have a self-confidence to build those two plans. Just doesn´t have the belief that at least the second one will work. But that´s very likely extremely unlikely, being a person like that lol.

Steve Davis probably was (and why not still is) much more straightforward person and a player than John Higgins. So personally, I must say that John Higgins is a better player. Is that the same as the superior, my language skills ain´t good enough to tell that...

But there´s your answer.

But still needs to understand the power of the nature. The see. Where there is something extremely, I mean EXTRAORDINARY, cold, somewhere really close is the extraordinary warm place also.

Could it work with the Nugget also? Can´t tell.

Re: Who is the superior player?

Postby SnookerFan

TheSaviour wrote:John Higgins certainly has plan A and plan B. And that´s always going to be something I really appreciate. No systematic person can miss both of those plans, if possessing those. But those plans needs to be the opposite ones, and build systematically. But if that´s the case, then certainy, yes! Can miss once, but never miss twice.

Obviously there can be persons who doesn´t have a self-confidence to build those two plans. Just doesn´t have the belief that at least the second one will work. But that´s very likely extremely unlikely, being a person like that lol.

Steve Davis probably was (and why not still is) much more straightforward person and a player than John Higgins. So personally, I must say that John Higgins is a better player. Is that the same as the superior, my language skills ain´t good enough to tell that...

But there´s your answer.

But still needs to understand the power of the nature. The see. Where there is something extremely, I mean EXTRAORDINARY, cold, somewhere really close is the extraordinary warm place also.

Could it work with the Nugget also? Can´t tell.


Truest thing you've ever said.


   

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