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Which 8 Ball Pool ? American, Chinese, English ?

Postby roy142857

Hoping someone knows more about this than me! I started thinking about this as I saw something about pool in Malta now being affiliated to European Blackball, and due to host the European Nations Cup in November.

What I (think I) do know

English 8 Ball and American 8 Ball are somewhat different games, and I've always thought the tables have a different pocket shape?

In the UK, Europe and elsewhere 'English 8 Ball' is divided by two sets of rules, one of which calls the game 'Blackball' to distinguish it from American 8 Ball. Pro players in the IPA have recently moved to Blackball rules, splitting them from the English Pool Association (EPA) who now ban anyone from playing in their competitions if they've played Blackball at county level or above. The EPA are members of the World Eight Ball Federation and the rules they play to are often called 'World rules', whilst the English Blackball Pool Federation are affiliated to the World Pool-Billiard Association (WPA), and via them to the World Confederation of Billiard Sports (who also have the IBSF and World Snooker as members) and the Internationall Olympic Committee.

I understand from their website that the WPA are promoting both '8 ball pool' (the US version) and 'Blackball' in North America and elsewhere - I wonder if this is just theoretical or actually happening? And apparently (per Wikipedia!) the American Poolplayers Association and something called the Valley National Eight-ball Association have variations from the WPA rules for the US version ...

I tried to get my head round the two sets of rules on the WPA website (8 ball and blackball) but just got confused, think I'll have to watch different games on youtube sometime ...

I thought the version played at the World Games this year was the American version, but am now wondering if it was actually Blackball. Anyone know?

8 ball pool is very popular in China, with big TV audiences, lots of players etc - but they are playing their own version which uses a snooker table and American style balls - they've signed Stephen Hendry and Gareth Potts to promote the game over the next several years. They are promoting the game as Chinese Eight Ball, but it's sometimes known as 'Black Eight'. The prize money Potts got for winning the Chinese Eight Ball Masters was 50,000 US dollars, so attractive for players I'd guess. To confuse the issue, there is an American pool variant called 'Chinese Eight Ball' played on a normal pool table, where the object balls are hit into the cue ball and have to be potted by playing a carom off the cue ball.

Anyone know more about the rule differences and politics involved in this? And how badly is the split affecting ordinary players in the UK? I gather there are big differences between counties on this.

Re: Which 8 Ball Pool ? American, Chinese, English ?

Postby Roland

Oh right, I thought Hendry was promoting the one where you pot your balls off the white. Can't say that one appeals to me.

The main difference for me in the pool I play is the tables, the UK pool tables with the small white, red and yellow balls is the pool I have no time for, especially with the 2 turns after a foul rule. The US version on the big tables where a ball has to hit a rail after contact, nominate pocket on black and after any foul the incoming player has ball in hand anywhere on the table is the best version of pool I've played. But I have no idea what it's officially called, I think it's World Rules pool. That's the best one anyway but I can't remember if you're allowed to pot an opponents ball as long as you hit your ball first or not.

You have summed it up well though Roy, the biggest problem with pool is that every time you play it, the person you end up playing uses different rules to everyone else so you end up disagreeing or forgetting the new rules as you play.

Re: Which 8 Ball Pool ? American, Chinese, English ?

Postby roy142857

Sonny wrote:Oh right, I thought Hendry was promoting the one where you pot your balls off the white. Can't say that one appeals to me.


re the Chinese version (as in, version played in China not potting off the white) what I read said 'on a snooker table' but videos I've seen seem to be on a 3/4 size or 2/3 size snooker table (so 8 or 9 foot long I guess) not full size. see the closing stages of the Chinese 8 Ball Masters final to see what I mean - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6MsF_iBIDg

Sonny wrote:The main difference for me in the pool I play is the tables, the UK pool tables with the small white, red and yellow balls is the pool I have no time for, especially with the 2 turns after a foul rule.


One of the biggest differences as far as I can tell between the rules that have been played in the UK and Blackball rules is that the '2 turns after a foul rule' doesn't exist in Blackball

Sonny wrote:The US version on the big tables where a ball has to hit a rail after contact, nominate pocket on black and after any foul the incoming player has ball in hand anywhere on the table is the best version of pool I've played. But I have no idea what it's officially called, I think it's World Rules pool. That's the best one anyway but I can't remember if you're allowed to pot an opponents ball as long as you hit your ball first or not.


'World Rules' strictly means the UK pool tables with the small white, red and yellow balls with the 2 turns after a foul rule (Because the rules are World Eight Ball Federation rules). But as the World Pool-Billiard Association issues the officially-recognised round the world rules for the US version, some people mean that when they say 'World Rules'. Would be best is people said 'WEBF rules', 'WPA rules' and 'Blackball Rules', but don't think a lot of club pool players know what 'WEPF' or 'WPA' are, let alone remembering which is which ...

Sonny wrote:You have summed it up well though Roy, the biggest problem with pool is that every time you play it, the person you end up playing uses different rules to everyone else so you end up disagreeing or forgetting the new rules as you play.


Having watched a little of both, I think Blackball rules sharpen the UK version of the game up quite a bit, would like to see that develop but the politics of the situation looks problematic. At least with the Blackball rules, every authority involved seems to agree that the rules issued by the WPA are the standard rules, just don't let the EPA find you playing Blackball if you ever want to compete in one of their competitions!

Re: Which 8 Ball Pool ? American, Chinese, English ?

Postby roy142857

roy142857 wrote:
re the Chinese version (as in, version played in China not potting off the white) what I read said 'on a snooker table' but videos I've seen seem to be on a 3/4 size or 2/3 size snooker table (so 8 or 9 foot long I guess) not full size. see the closing stages of the Chinese 8 Ball Masters final to see what I mean - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6MsF_iBIDg


A bit of digging confirmed that the table for Chinese Eight Ball is 9' x 4.5' with snooker rails/pockets, and that the balls are the type typically used for Nine Ball.

Edit: Just a thought, would those dimensions make it a good table to play 6 Red Snooker on?

And I found ... it's yet another version of Eight Ball Pool with politics interfering. Apparently the main promoter of Chinese Eight Ball is Joy, the table manufacturer and snooker/pool hall chain. Their big rival in China is Star, who have apparently told players they sponsor not to play in the Chinese Eight Ball competitions ...