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Re: Welsh Open Qualifying Draw and Format

Postby JIMO96

Only 90 entries......this is an alarming trend for snooker, it looks like the expense of entering tournaments is outweighing everything else for players at the other end of the rankings.

Is there a case for offering first season pros, particularly the overseas ones, some sort of grant to help with their expenditure? I don't know the solution....maybe hold all the qualifiers at the start of the season, but that makes the calendar/rankings even more distorted than they currently are.

I see the WSA have moved heaven and earth to let Day and Dale play at the main venue....and thats a good thing, and makes commercial sense, but....could they not have afforded Wenbo and the 4 Chinese players ranked 49-64 the same privilege at last weeks Hainan qualifiers? They used to hold back multiple rounds to ensure Drago played at the Malta Cup(!)

Re: Welsh Open Qualifying Draw and Format

Postby Wildey

JIMO96 wrote:Only 90 entries......this is an alarming trend for snooker, it looks like the expense of entering tournaments is outweighing everything else for players at the other end of the rankings.

Is there a case for offering first season pros, particularly the overseas ones, some sort of grant to help with their expenditure? I don't know the solution....maybe hold all the qualifiers at the start of the season, but that makes the calendar/rankings even more distorted than they currently are.

I see the WSA have moved heaven and earth to let Day and Dale play at the main venue....and thats a good thing, and makes commercial sense, but....could they not have afforded Wenbo and the 4 Chinese players ranked 49-64 the same privilege at last weeks Hainan qualifiers? They used to hold back multiple rounds to ensure Drago played at the Malta Cup(!)

next season if pros not entering best amataurs on the Q School rankings will get spots in the main draw of ranking events.

Re: Welsh Open Qualifying Draw and Format

Postby Wildey

Sonny wrote:Is that true?

http://www.worldsnooker.com/page/NewsAr ... 67,00.html

A new Q School ranking list will also be introduced, with players earning one point for every frame won. During the main tour season, should any of the tournament draws fall below a total entry of 96 (or 128 in 2013/14) then the field will be topped up to 96 or 128 with the highest ranked players from the Q-School list.

Re: Welsh Open Qualifying Draw and Format

Postby JIMO96

I'm not sure thats the best solution either....a circuit already bursting at the seams with British players will have even more British players in its tournaments.

Re: Welsh Open Qualifying Draw and Format

Postby Roland

It's a step in the right direction though JIMO96. As I was saying to Ben earlier, the younger generation breaking through will have to spend a significant portion of the year in Asia during their careers so the young Asian players will get their chance.

Re: Welsh Open Qualifying Draw and Format

Postby JIMO96

The only way the Asian players will get a fair chance is if the qualifying for Asian events is actually held in Asia. Currently, the only UK players who have to travel to China will have qualified (in Sheffield!), and therefore reached a stage where the prize money pays for it.

Re: Welsh Open Qualifying Draw and Format

Postby Witz78

this transitional phase of snooker frustrates me

i wish we could just fast track everything to when the full new tour calendar is settled and established, the new rankings set up is in place, the flatter qualifying and whole tour structure is finalised, as at the moment everything has a feel of a mess, albeit a far more enjoyable mess than the real mess under Rodney banker.

where the hell they gonna fit these 4 new Power Snooker events into the calendar tho?

the Premier League already has to go IMO and the Championship League is no longer needed. And the PTCs ultimately have to be downscaled too.

As for qualifying / foreign tournaments, i think there should be a qualifying block for maybe 2 weeks where the qualifiers for 4 tournaments are decided then the players can plan there movements.

Anyway moving to a flat 128 qualifying set up needed as without it we will end up with tournaments where theres a few walkovers as there no way the top 16 are going to play in every event.

Re: Welsh Open Qualifying Draw and Format

Postby Wildey

where the hell they gonna fit these 4 new Power Snooker events into the calendar tho?


i have a good sugestion

Image

:john:

Re: Welsh Open Qualifying Draw and Format

Postby Roland

JIMO96 wrote:The only way the Asian players will get a fair chance is if the qualifying for Asian events is actually held in Asia. Currently, the only UK players who have to travel to China will have qualified (in Sheffield!), and therefore reached a stage where the prize money pays for it.


I agree that there should be qualification rounds held in Asia for the Asian players, I've been saying that since the days of everything being at Pontins. Gradually things are changing for the better though and it won't be long before that starts happening.

Re: Welsh Open Qualifying Draw and Format

Postby Monique

JIMO96 wrote:The only way the Asian players will get a fair chance is if the qualifying for Asian events is actually held in Asia. Currently, the only UK players who have to travel to China will have qualified (in Sheffield!), and therefore reached a stage where the prize money pays for it.


If a flat (and fairer) structure has to be put into place and a money based ranking list updated after each tournament also the only viable solution is to hold all tournaments at the actual venue in one go, from last 128 to final. The first drawback though is that it's unsustainable for the lowest ranked players unless the price money gets significantly higher (which is what allows similar structures to work in other sports). The second drawback is that with no seeding the organisers and sponsors will have concerns about the top boys (those who sell) missing the "telly" stage. There are advantages though: with all players possibly making the trip they all will know well in advance that they need visas, accommodations etc, making the logistic easier for the players and their managers. Another positive is that in many ways the ranking will become less relevant except for staying on the MT, effectively allowing the players to manage their season better and to find a better balance between their job and their private life should they wish so. As snooker is not the kind of sport where you retire at 30 with a fortune, this IS important. Most players will reach a stage where they want to start a family while still having many years in the game and its exponents are the bigger asset in any sport.
One concern I have is that holding a full tournament in one go with a long format will be deemed "tedious" and "too expensive" and will open the door to more shortenings. I never adhered to the idea that very long formats are needed to determine the better players but they definitely bring other things, a different mindset, a different type of tension and I would hate to see them all go … well there's already only the WC surviving now already.

As for including amateurs in the draw if it's not filled up, that seems a good idea on paper but I doubt that many amateurs will be able to face the expenses.

Re: Welsh Open Qualifying Draw and Format

Postby Wildey

Regarding amataurs its on a first refusal higher up the Q School Rankings they are.... i think they will definitly find 5 or 6 players out of the many that try to get on tour to take up the offer to play 1 maybe 2 ranking events....

if they have ambition they will have to sacrifice a lot to get there and that includes their wallett.

Re: Welsh Open Qualifying Draw and Format

Postby Monique

Wild wrote:Regarding amataurs its on a first refusal higher up the Q School Rankings they are.... i think they will definitly find 5 or 6 players out of the many that try to get on tour to take up the offer to play 1 maybe 2 ranking events....

if they have ambition they will have to sacrifice a lot to get there and that includes their wallett.


True Wild but once again as hard as you try you can't spend money you don't have, not for long anyway. That's the basic line. Many may be ready to do the sacrifices, willing to spend the money if they can find it BUT if they don't have it - or a sponsor ready to spend it on them - there is no way they will be able to get there.

Re: Welsh Open Qualifying Draw and Format

Postby Wildey

Monique wrote:
Wild wrote:Regarding amataurs its on a first refusal higher up the Q School Rankings they are.... i think they will definitly find 5 or 6 players out of the many that try to get on tour to take up the offer to play 1 maybe 2 ranking events....

if they have ambition they will have to sacrifice a lot to get there and that includes their wallett.


True Wild but once again as hard as you try you can't spend money you don't have, not for long anyway. That's the basic line. Many may be ready to do the sacrifices, willing to spend the money if they can find it BUT if they don't have it - or a sponsor ready to spend it on them - there is no way they will be able to get there.


thats life monique.

sociaty is full of unfullfilled talents in every walk of life because of lack of funding then they move on to something else or they have to get loans etc like students do to try and fullfill their talent

Re: Welsh Open Qualifying Draw and Format

Postby SnookerFan

Wild wrote:
where the hell they gonna fit these 4 new Power Snooker events into the calendar tho?


i have a good sugestion

Image

:john:


rofl rofl rofl Wild, you can be quite funny when you try.

Re: Welsh Open Qualifying Draw and Format

Postby JIMO96

Good replies guys....

Witz78: it is a bit of a mess just now, but you're right, it's a much more preferable mess and I'm sure Bazza will deliver a better circuit eventually.

Monique: you hit on a fair point there....players can't retire when they're 30, and have to strike a career/family balance when they reach their later years (unlike tennis players, footballers etc). And I agree that Barrys idea of a 128 player tour can only work if the last 128 receive prize money in every event.

Sonny: I hope you're right, and I also hope that if this happens, we don't see a shortfall of about 40 entries cos the Brits can't be bothered travelling.

Wild: there'll be no shortage of Q-school top-up players ready to grab their chance to play in the big events, one of Barrys better ideas.....I just hope it doesn't mean even more British players on the tour.

Re: Welsh Open Draw and Format

Postby Wildey

what you have to remember Brits wont get Tocken Wild Cards like the Likes of Brecel and Lucky Fatnani got they have got to go through the Qualifying Routes and get there.

there will be Q Schools in other parts of the World at some Point and a more global Qualifying Route but it takes Time to get it up Running and Worth While.

Re: Welsh Open Draw and Format

Postby Witz78

just studied the draw and have noticed a World Snooker cockerel up (nothing new there)

WHY ARE HIGGINS AND DING DUE TO MEET IN THE LAST 16 ??

also i notice Ronnie and Judd are in the same quarter here as well as the German Masters and World Open

Re: Welsh Open Draw and Format

Postby Casey

Witz78 wrote:just studied the draw and have noticed a World Snooker cockerel up (nothing new there)

WHY ARE HIGGINS AND DING DUE TO MEET IN THE LAST 16 ??

also i notice Ronnie and Judd are in the same quarter here as well as the German Masters and World Open


Ding will have to swap with Stevens or MaGuire who shouldn't be paired for the L16.

Re: Welsh Open Draw and Format

Postby Witz78

Casey wrote:
Witz78 wrote:just studied the draw and have noticed a World Snooker cockerel up (nothing new there)

WHY ARE HIGGINS AND DING DUE TO MEET IN THE LAST 16 ??

also i notice Ronnie and Judd are in the same quarter here as well as the German Masters and World Open


Ding will have to swap with Stevens or MaGuire who shouldn't be paired for the L16.


Dott and Lee i see, or is Dott top 8 at the mo?

even im losing track of rankings now haha

Re: Welsh Open Draw and Format

Postby Wildey

Casey wrote:
Witz78 wrote:just studied the draw and have noticed a World Snooker cockerel up (nothing new there)

WHY ARE HIGGINS AND DING DUE TO MEET IN THE LAST 16 ??

also i notice Ronnie and Judd are in the same quarter here as well as the German Masters and World Open


Ding will have to swap with Stevens or MaGuire who shouldn't be paired for the L16.

http://www.worldsnooker.com/staticFiles ... 409,00.pdf

For The Welsh Open Maguire is Seeded No 8 and Ding Seeded no 9 so the Draw is Correct.

Re: Welsh Open Draw and Format

Postby GJ

vodkadiet wrote:Wild

Your thoughts on Fu vs Rigsby?

Will it be televised?


wild is busy tonight :evilgrin:

its 2 tables and both available to watch

Re: Welsh Open Draw and Format

Postby GJ

If ding beats mavs the top 16 spots look sorted for the worlds

Re: Welsh Open Draw and Format

Postby Witz78

GJ wrote:If ding beats mavs the top 16 spots look sorted for the worlds


yeh they WILL be sorted

Mavis has to reach the quarters and hope Bingham loses Round 1 to make the top 16

or the semis if Ronnies loses in round 1

Re: Welsh Open Draw and Format

Postby vodkadiet

GJ wrote:If ding beats mavs the top 16 spots look sorted for the worlds


I hope Rigsby is in the 16, as I wany hi beaten at The Crucible and not in a cubicle.

As far as Rigsby losing; Crucible > Cubicle

Re: Welsh Open Draw and Format

Postby GJ

Witz78 wrote:
GJ wrote:If ding beats mavs the top 16 spots look sorted for the worlds


yeh they WILL be sorted

Mavis has to reach the quarters and hope Bingham loses Round 1 to make the top 16

or the semis if Ronnies loses in round 1



mavis for me isnt fit to be to top 16

so hope ding beats him <cool>

Re: Welsh Open Draw and Format

Postby Witz78

yeh Mavis is a joke

how the hell he could get in the top 16 anyway is a joke, can anyone even think of a decent run hes had in a tourney?