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Crucible Classics #18

Postby Pink Ball » 17 Apr 2020 Read

At number 18 in my countdown is:

18. 2015 Final: Stuart Bingham 18-15 Shaun Murphy
44-103(68); 51-69(59); 5-74(65); 105(105)-0; 68(56)-15; 0-90(90); 55-7; 73(65)-30; 57(57)-74(74); 1-106(106); 14-121(121); 41-97(51); 76(76)-1; 129(123)-7; 113(89)-0; 0-76(76); 67(53)-22; 87(87)-4; 68(51)-40; 112(112)-0; 95(50)-23; 4-80(59); 87(87)-0; 0-84(84); 86(57)-7; 6-73; 102(102)-6; 55-75(75); 29-68(64); 0-76; 80-56; 68(55)-3; 88(88)-1

Match Progress: 0-1, 0-2, 0-3, 1-3, 2-3, 2-4, 3-4, 4-4, 4-5, 4-6, 4-7, 4-8, 5-8, 6-8, 7-8, 7-9, 8-9, 9-9, 10-9, 11-9, 12-9, 12-10, 13-10, 13-11, 14-11, 14-12, 15-12, 15-13, 15-14, 15-15, 16-15, 17-15, 18-15

What are your memories/observations of this Crucible Classic?
Last edited by Pink Ball on 17 Apr 2020, edited 1 time in total.

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby Acé » 17 Apr 2020 Read

Worst final of the last decade but it seems like every decade there's a WC with 2 really bland and uncharismatic players, in the 2000s you had the awful Dott/Ebdon match and in the last decade, Bingham/Murphy.

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby Iranu » 17 Apr 2020 Read

Acé wrote:Worst final of the last decade but it seems like every decade there's a WC with 2 really bland and uncharismatic players, in the 2000s you had the awful Dott/Ebdon match and in the last decade, Bingham/Murphy.

Did you watch this final? How was this worse than 2010, at least?

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby McManusFan » 17 Apr 2020 Read

Absolute cracker of a match, I remember being really worried when Murphy levelled after the thirtieth frame. A really good mix of safety, and high scoring. Probably the second best final of the last five years, being beaten only by the Higgins Williams one.

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby mick745 » 17 Apr 2020 Read

I think at 15-all there was a frame that lasted well over an hour that Bingham won, this proved to be the crucial moment.

Bingham beat O'Sullivan, Trump and Murphy in consecutive matches to lift the title, and boy was he chuffed.

Bingham purchased the table afterwards to install at his home.

Great story.

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby SnookerFan » 17 Apr 2020 Read

mick745 wrote:I think at 15-all there was a frame that lasted well over an hour that Bingham won, this proved to be the crucial moment.

Bingham beat O'Sullivan, Trump and Murphy in consecutive matches to lift the title, and boy was he chuffed.

Bingham purchased the table afterwards to install at his home.

Great story.


He beat Graeme Dott in the second round too.

So in winning the trophy, he beat three former World Champions and also somebody who would go on to lift the trophy a few years later.

That has to be one of the hardest routes to the trophy ever, surely?

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby mick745 » 17 Apr 2020 Read

SnookerFan wrote:
mick745 wrote:I think at 15-all there was a frame that lasted well over an hour that Bingham won, this proved to be the crucial moment.

Bingham beat O'Sullivan, Trump and Murphy in consecutive matches to lift the title, and boy was he chuffed.

Bingham purchased the table afterwards to install at his home.

Great story.


He beat Graeme Dott in the second round too.

So in winning the trophy, he beat three former World Champions and also somebody who would go on to lift the trophy a few years later.

That has to be one of the hardest routes to the trophy ever, surely?


Not sure it quite eclipses Stephen Hendry's - Paul Hunter, James Wattana, Matthew Stevens, Ronnie O'Sullivan and Mark Williams route to his 1999 win, but yes, i don't think anyone can say Bingham didn't deserve it that year.

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby SnookerFan » 17 Apr 2020 Read

mick745 wrote:Not sure it quite eclipses Stephen Hendry's - Paul Hunter, James Wattana, Matthew Stevens, Ronnie O'Sullivan and Mark Williams route to his 1999 win, but yes, i don't think anyone can say Bingham didn't deserve it that year.


Excellent example. And Hendry did have a hell of a tough route.

What slightly bothers with Bingham is that people do act like he doesn't deserve it. When clearly he does.

Yes, he was a journeyman for a long period of his career. But it's been nearly nine years since he won his first tournament, the Australian Open. I remember people on this forum being really aggressive towards Bingham, and critical of Mark Williams for losing to him. Since then he's one several tournaments, including two thirds of the 'triple crown'. He's clearly a great player, even if he was a late developer. And don't forget he won the Premier League as well, back when that was thing.

I don't get why people think he's a mug. It's like everything that has happened in his career since 2011 doesn't exist.
Last edited by SnookerFan on 17 Apr 2020, edited 1 time in total.

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby SnookerEd25 » 17 Apr 2020 Read

Great final. Two evenly matched players, one a previous winner. Although neither could be considered amongst my favourites, the drama held well throughout. And I also enjoyed the 2006 & 2010 finals. A World final is something else, so only disappoints me if it is too one-sided. Hence, the weakest finals for me were 1983, 1989, 1991, 1993, 1995, 2004, 2008, 2009 and last year. Despite admiring Judd's snooker, and being pleased for him to finally break his duck, it just didn't have the edge of the seat tension of the previous couple of years - and 2015.
Last edited by SnookerEd25 on 17 Apr 2020, edited 1 time in total.

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby lhpirnie » 17 Apr 2020 Read

I thought it was a great final. Bingham displayed everything he had learned as a professional in all those years, and he has subsequently shown it wasn't a fluke - a regular tournament winner if not a prolific one.


Shaun Murphy was suffering from back problems during that tournament, and needed physio just to be able to play. That's not to take anything away from Bingham - being able to last the 17-day marathon is part of the challenge.

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby SnookerEd25 » 17 Apr 2020 Read

There is a book by the Canadian writer, Mordecai Richler, who wrote predominantly about Baseball but became fascinated by snooker in the '80s, when the Canadian players were a major force in the game. When they fell away, he became a fan of Hendry, and wrote this, about the Hendry-Bingham match in 2000 (when Bingham, ranked 92, won 10-7) in the book 'Mordecai Richler on Snooker' :

'Besting Hendry at the table had to make for a hallelujah day for Bingham, but he struck me, perhaps unreasonably, as a sad case. Somebody who had reached his professional life's zenith at the know-nothing age of twenty-three, the rest likely to be a dying fall. True, his most recent ranking was number thirty-five, a giant step up from ninety-two, but that placement still confined him in the thick of the also-rans who had to qualify for major tournaments. In my mind's eye, I saw him fifty years on, dandling a grandchild on his knee even as he reached for a scrapbook of yellowing newspaper cuttings; "why, back in the year 2000, I drew Stephen Hendry in the Crucible's first round. Everybody assumed your grandad was a goner, but..." '

Unfortunately, Richler died shortly after the books publication in 2001, so never got to see Bingham win any of his six ranking titles, or reach no.2 in the world, let alone the real zenith of his career in 2015...

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby Holden Chinaski » 17 Apr 2020 Read

SnookerEd25 wrote:There is a book by the Canadian writer, Mordecai Richler, who wrote predominantly about Baseball but became fascinated by snooker in the '80s, when the Canadian players were a major force in the game. When they fell away, he became a fan of Hendry, and wrote this, about the Hendry-Bingham match in 2000 (when Bingham, ranked 92, won 10-7) in the book 'Mordecai Richler on Snooker' :

'Besting Hendry at the table had to make for a hallelujah day for Bingham, but he struck me, perhaps unreasonably, as a sad case. Somebody who had reached his professional life's zenith at the know-nothing age of twenty-three, the rest likely to be a dying fall. True, his most recent ranking was number thirty-five, a giant step up from ninety-two, but that placement still confined him in the thick of the also-rans who had to qualify for major tournaments. In my mind's eye, I saw him fifty years on, dandling a grandchild on his knee even as he reached for a scrapbook of yellowing newspaper cuttings; "why, back in the year 2000, I drew Stephen Hendry in the Crucible's first round. Everybody assumed your grandad was a goner, but..." '

Unfortunately, Richler died shortly after the books publication in 2001, so never got to see Bingham win any of his six ranking titles, or reach no.2 in the world, let alone the real zenith of his career in 2015...

That's funny. It's a shame indeed that he never lived to see Bingham's success.

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby Alex0paul » 17 Apr 2020 Read

Murphy has without doubt the easiest route to win a World Title ever seen and still failed

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby Juddernaut88 » 17 Apr 2020 Read

At the time I didn't seem to mind Bingham and somewhat pleased he won, although I was 50/50 in terms of who won the final but in recent years I've started to dislike Bingham, I can't really explain what it is.

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby SnookerEd25 » 17 Apr 2020 Read

I've always thought he seems a decent enough guy; his play just doesn't excite me though, and the 'winner winner chicken dinner' thing is very cringe.

Then there was the betting ban, guilty of rank stupidity at the very least, which did nothing to further his cause.

I don't dislike him particularly, as I do some others (Carter, Selt for example), he's just a bit 'meh'.

In my opinion.

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby Acé » 17 Apr 2020 Read

Iranu wrote:Did you watch this final? How was this worse than 2010, at least?



Characters make the sport for me and these 2 don't so it was hard to get behind either, I don't roll with Bingham or Murphy. Sue me for liking flair players I just don't like what you basically like and I frankly don't have to, I can like who I want and can pay my money to go see who I want

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby SnookerFan » 17 Apr 2020 Read

Holden Chinaski wrote:
SnookerEd25 wrote:There is a book by the Canadian writer, Mordecai Richler, who wrote predominantly about Baseball but became fascinated by snooker in the '80s, when the Canadian players were a major force in the game. When they fell away, he became a fan of Hendry, and wrote this, about the Hendry-Bingham match in 2000 (when Bingham, ranked 92, won 10-7) in the book 'Mordecai Richler on Snooker' :

'Besting Hendry at the table had to make for a hallelujah day for Bingham, but he struck me, perhaps unreasonably, as a sad case. Somebody who had reached his professional life's zenith at the know-nothing age of twenty-three, the rest likely to be a dying fall. True, his most recent ranking was number thirty-five, a giant step up from ninety-two, but that placement still confined him in the thick of the also-rans who had to qualify for major tournaments. In my mind's eye, I saw him fifty years on, dandling a grandchild on his knee even as he reached for a scrapbook of yellowing newspaper cuttings; "why, back in the year 2000, I drew Stephen Hendry in the Crucible's first round. Everybody assumed your grandad was a goner, but..." '

Unfortunately, Richler died shortly after the books publication in 2001, so never got to see Bingham win any of his six ranking titles, or reach no.2 in the world, let alone the real zenith of his career in 2015...

That's funny. It's a shame indeed that he never lived to see Bingham's success.


Just shows that you can never tell in sport, I guess.

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby SnookerFan » 17 Apr 2020 Read

SnookerEd25 wrote:There is a book by the Canadian writer, Mordecai Richler, who wrote predominantly about Baseball but became fascinated by snooker in the '80s, when the Canadian players were a major force in the game. When they fell away, he became a fan of Hendry, and wrote this, about the Hendry-Bingham match in 2000 (when Bingham, ranked 92, won 10-7) in the book 'Mordecai Richler on Snooker' :

'Besting Hendry at the table had to make for a hallelujah day for Bingham, but he struck me, perhaps unreasonably, as a sad case. Somebody who had reached his professional life's zenith at the know-nothing age of twenty-three, the rest likely to be a dying fall. True, his most recent ranking was number thirty-five, a giant step up from ninety-two, but that placement still confined him in the thick of the also-rans who had to qualify for major tournaments. In my mind's eye, I saw him fifty years on, dandling a grandchild on his knee even as he reached for a scrapbook of yellowing newspaper cuttings; "why, back in the year 2000, I drew Stephen Hendry in the Crucible's first round. Everybody assumed your grandad was a goner, but..." '

Unfortunately, Richler died shortly after the books publication in 2001, so never got to see Bingham win any of his six ranking titles, or reach no.2 in the world, let alone the real zenith of his career in 2015...


Did he ever predict Ronnie's decline?

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby SnookerEd25 » 17 Apr 2020 Read

Kind of...but only due to his drug use and priory re-hab sessions.

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby Alex0paul » 17 Apr 2020 Read

SnookerEd25 wrote:There is a book by the Canadian writer, Mordecai Richler, who wrote predominantly about Baseball but became fascinated by snooker in the '80s, when the Canadian players were a major force in the game. When they fell away, he became a fan of Hendry, and wrote this, about the Hendry-Bingham match in 2000 (when Bingham, ranked 92, won 10-7) in the book 'Mordecai Richler on Snooker' :

'Besting Hendry at the table had to make for a hallelujah day for Bingham, but he struck me, perhaps unreasonably, as a sad case. Somebody who had reached his professional life's zenith at the know-nothing age of twenty-three, the rest likely to be a dying fall. True, his most recent ranking was number thirty-five, a giant step up from ninety-two, but that placement still confined him in the thick of the also-rans who had to qualify for major tournaments. In my mind's eye, I saw him fifty years on, dandling a grandchild on his knee even as he reached for a scrapbook of yellowing newspaper cuttings; "why, back in the year 2000, I drew Stephen Hendry in the Crucible's first round. Everybody assumed your grandad was a goner, but..." '

Unfortunately, Richler died shortly after the books publication in 2001, so never got to see Bingham win any of his six ranking titles, or reach no.2 in the world, let alone the real zenith of his career in 2015...


That’s fantastic

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby Iranu » 17 Apr 2020 Read

Acé wrote:
Iranu wrote:Did you watch this final? How was this worse than 2010, at least?



Characters make the sport for me and these 2 don't so it was hard to get behind either, I don't roll with Bingham or Murphy. Sue me for liking flair players I just don't like what you basically like and I frankly don't have to, I can like who I want and can pay my money to go see who I want

I hate Murphy but not thinking he’s a flair player is a bit unusual, I’d have thought.

My favourite players are Ronnie, MJW and Ding, for what it’s worth. At least two of those are flair players.

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby Acé » 17 Apr 2020 Read

Iranu wrote:
Acé wrote:
Iranu wrote:Did you watch this final? How was this worse than 2010, at least?



Characters make the sport for me and these 2 don't so it was hard to get behind either, I don't roll with Bingham or Murphy. Sue me for liking flair players I just don't like what you basically like and I frankly don't have to, I can like who I want and can pay my money to go see who I want

I hate Murphy but not thinking he’s a flair player is a bit unusual, I’d have thought.

My favourite players are Ronnie, MJW and Ding, for what it’s worth. At least two of those are flair players.


You having a laugh? Ronnie's your fav player? I've seen you insult him plenty + you defend Selby to the death. You don't sound like a Ronnie fan at all otherwise you wouldn't think Selby is unbeatable. I've met loads of Ronnie fans when I attend matches and they all hate Selby

Man so many frauds here

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby Acé » 17 Apr 2020 Read

Selby fans are the worst though, they think Snooker belongs to Selby cuz he apparently plays "true snooker" and if you don't support him or like him you're not a true snooker fan, whatever rubbish they pile out. As if like you're not allowed to dislike him

You don't hear that rubbish when plenty disliked Hendry in the 90s, or Higgins, or a few that dislike Ronnie for his antics etc but if you dislike Selby? You can't be a Snooker fan LOL

Very sensitive and insecure bunch, kinda like Djokovic fans.
Last edited by Acé on 17 Apr 2020, edited 1 time in total.

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby Acé » 17 Apr 2020 Read

Badsnookerplayer wrote:Can you not be a Selby fan and a Ronnie fan?

Is fraud the crime you were talking about earlier??


Being a Selby AND a Ronnie fan is like being a Federer AND a Djokovic fan

IMPOSSIBLE

2 entirely different characters on the spectrum, different playing styles, fan bases, heated rivals as they contested in many finals etc

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby Badsnookerplayer » 17 Apr 2020 Read

Acé wrote:
Badsnookerplayer wrote:Can you not be a Selby fan and a Ronnie fan?

Is fraud the crime you were talking about earlier??


Being a Selby AND a Ronnie fan is like being a Federer AND a Djokovic fan

IMPOSSIBLE

2 entirely different characters on the spectrum, different playing styles, fan bases, heated rivals as they contested in many finals etc

So like if it was a Venn diagram then the circles wouldn't overlap. Is that what you mean?

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby Acé » 17 Apr 2020 Read

Imagine being a Ronnie and a Selby fan after 2014 WC

Imagine being a Federer and a Djokovic fan after all those Wimbledon losses

doesn't sound right does it?

Re: Crucible Classics #18

Postby SnookerFan » 17 Apr 2020 Read

Badsnookerplayer wrote:Can you not be a Selby fan and a Ronnie fan?

Is fraud the crime you were talking about earlier??


I'd have thought so, but everyone acts as if it's impossible.
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