Mark Selby.... Attacking or Negative Safeties !!!

GJ wrote:I didnt see ding match did selby play slower than usual or was ding possibly looking to appease his home fans after losing ?

lets put it like this if it was Higgins that was playing he would not have played any differently to Selby and i doubt ding would have said anything.

its just become open book to take a swipe at selby now.

Wild wrote:

GJ wrote:I didnt see ding match did selby play slower than usual or was ding possibly looking to appease his home fans after losing ?

lets put it like this if it was Higgins that was playing he would not have played any differently to Selby and i doubt ding would have said anything.

its just become open book to take a swipe at selby now.

cheers mate

I have alot of time for ding but in this case

ding

Selby played the same as he always does. The fact is Ding had a safety game and thought about his shots which is why it took longer. Selby did nothing wrong. In fact the only thing I would suggest he needs to do differently to this week is to go for more pots after he's won the frame. He's too scared of the counter when 70 ahead with 67 on. I say buck it, if the player is going to get back in the frame let him do it immediately rather than 10 minutes down the line after lots of safety. Chances are a lot more frames will be killed off quicker and so what if he occasionally misses one and sticks them up, as long as the other player comes to the table needing snookers then Selby is always going to get another shot and is more than likely going to win the frame.

Apart from that one aspect, his snooker was as near flawless as you can get in the last session of the final and he will take some serious stopping at the Crucible.

yes good point he does do that but ive seen someone like Hendry go for that one pot to many when the frame won and lost it ...

its a balance he needs to get hes such a good potter at the moment he needs to back himself more.

Selby likely to be fatigued, why he's playing an exho in China now is beyond me but there's no way he can produce his A-game for 120+ frames at the Crucible and win and you can quote me on that

Wild wrote:yes good point he does do that but ive seen someone like Hendry go for that one pot to many when the frame won and lost it ...

its a balance he needs to get hes such a good potter at the moment he needs to back himself more.

Well that's exactly what he said himself. He sometimes tends to be over cautious and it doesn't help his own game. But now that he is aware of it I expect to see more positivity in his game overall. Which I personally find good.

WTF is he still doing in China?

Bourne wrote:Selby likely to be fatigued, why he's playing an exho in China now is beyond me but there's no way he can produce his A-game for 120+ frames at the Crucible and win and you can quote me on that

if correct selby is a mug

Exho with Higgins in Syan for two days

hmm may be tempted to pick lee afterall agianst higgins , no chance selby will lose to poor mans version

Bourne wrote:Exho with Higgins in Syan for two days

buck me higgins got scottish pro championship before crucible

and people think they tired

GJ wrote:My overall views on selby

1. John parrot sumed it up when he called him the hoover and clearing the table and selby is quality at this and when he plays like that he is a class act. and he never looks like missing.

2. When he tries to slow things away down and put his opponent out of their own style it not only affects the opponent but selby and this does him no favours, yes it may work agianst ronnie but other players it wont work agianst.

For me he should have more than 1 ranking title but if he plays like point 2 he will continue to win less titles than he should.

He has all the shots in the book but win more titles he needs to adopt my number 1 and forget number 2 as its only appears to work agianst ronnie.

but your no 1 point works only when he's on his A game and what has he do if he's not on his A game (which is more often)? give it up? try every pot knowing he's not gonna get it?
I find a safety part of his game very entertaining whether it's played negatively or positively, but I agree with most of what's been said above, he does tend to over think some shots maybe trying to be more creative and thus bogging himself done and loosing the rhythm
as for slowing down tactics he deffinitely resorts to them sometimes but I haven't seen anything really shocking from him of late and actually I don't see anything wrong about it

Wild wrote:what has been noticeable last week he was playing like no 1 made 8 centuries the highest count by a single player in any tournament for years but he still had negative comment from ding or journos twisting dings words, either way it was way off the mark.

its now becoming the standard excuse when selby playing.

it's been all over the press and on different blogs for ages so I guess Ding can hear and see it so often he might just have learned the phrase

Black2white wrote:

Wild wrote:what has been noticeable last week he was playing like no 1 made 8 centuries the highest count by a single player in any tournament for years but he still had negative comment from ding or journos twisting dings words, either way it was way off the mark.

its now becoming the standard excuse when selby playing.

it's been all over the press and on different blogs for ages so I guess Ding can hear and see it so often he might just have learned the phrase

that what i think players are starting to re cycle old criticism and using them to justify why a match gets bogged down or slow...

Dott is obviously self conscious of matches dragging on and he also put blame on Selby after last years WC Semi final.

its time players look in the mirror and take some of the blame not automatic say ohhh well selby in the match ill just blame him everyone will believe me.

im not a big reader of books and the only books i have thats biographical is Alex Higgins because of the complex of his life...

i never even got the Clive Everton blackball wizard book.

but im seriously thinking of getting the Dott book because i think he has had such a up and down life in resent years its compelling his thoughts going in to matches now compared to pre 2006 he looks a different player to me.

Okay, Let's get one thing out of the way. Selby is a fantastic player. On his A game he just does not miss.

But when I said that he is the single most negative player in snooker at the moment I absolutely mean it. I watched every match he played that was televised in China and I have several of his matches from 2009 and 2010 WC. The one thing in common with them all is that you could count on the fingers of one hand the number of times he got in with a positive safety shot. This is nothing to do with quick or slow play but these tactics PROMOTE SLOW PLAY.

You can just about predict the way a frame will go when you see the red going up the baulk end resulting in the other player many times having no option but to roll up. Wild mate, I think it was you that said the number of re racks meant that the tactics were correct. I respectfully say this is wrong. This is part of Mark's play not to lose mentality which will completely work against someone like O'sullivan. This is proven by his Welsh Open win where Ronnie was clearly annoyed but put him up against someone as stubborn as him with him employing these tactics and you make for a long slow drawn out game.

there is nothing negative about selbys safety play period no ifs buts or maybees about it.

if other players complain its theire insecuritiies about their game unable to compete with him on that level.

Selby is one of the most creative attacking safety player in snooker today but players and fans got it in to their heads hes negative because he plays a game thats just so tight and goes over their heads.

i respecty you mate without knowing you but on this your a million percent wrong but its your opinion.

An attacking safety player is one that opens the balls up whilst attempting to keep the cue ball safe.Selby very rarely does that. He is a great safety player though.

Thats the type of safeties Hendry plays and i agree that is very attacking but it can go wrong its a risk you take when playing that shot and it has to be perfect or you let a ball on.

My definition of a attacking safety shot is when theres a tough shot to play when many players will either roll in to a ball to play defensive Mark Selby will always look for the Possitive option where he if he can takes the White Back to balk and puts his oponement in real trouble.

lets agree to disagree its now clear people see attacking safety shots in different light.

snooky147 wrote:Okay, Let's get one thing out of the way. Selby is a fantastic player. On his A game he just does not miss.

But when I said that he is the single most negative player in snooker at the moment I absolutely mean it. I watched every match he played that was televised in China and I have several of his matches from 2009 and 2010 WC. The one thing in common with them all is that you could count on the fingers of one hand the number of times he got in with a positive safety shot. This is nothing to do with quick or slow play but these tactics PROMOTE SLOW PLAY.

You can just about predict the way a frame will go when you see the red going up the baulk end resulting in the other player many times having no option but to roll up. Wild mate, I think it was you that said the number of re racks meant that the tactics were correct. I respectfully say this is wrong. This is part of Mark's play not to lose mentality which will completely work against someone like O'sullivan. This is proven by his Welsh Open win where Ronnie was clearly annoyed but pit him up against someone as stubborn as him with him employing these tactics and you make for a long slow drawn out game.

I don't disagree with that. But I think in this day and age of players being capable of potting everything, the right thing to do tactically is try to make sure your opponent can go at absolutely nothing and put the white in the most awkward place on the table and Selby does this better than anyone. Is it negative? To some I guess, but to me it's being a rock hard solid match player. If you match him at safety then yes, it can drawn out but the onus is on the more attacking player to take the game to him.

what i dont get is this roll up to the pack theary that means a re rack ?

does selby do that more than anyone else ?

Wild wrote:what i dont get is this roll up to the pack theary that means a re rack ?

does selby do that more than anyone else ?

Yes, by a mile.

really ??

well i now know my job during the WC Pinpoint running in to packs from every player to see if your right

It takes two to tango. I think a lot of players do it to him to make it look like he's to blame for the re-rack. Classic case of that was Ronnie in the Masters final. But Selby is always the first to say "re-rack" when he spots the stalemate. Why should the onus be on him to end it always?

yes im sorry but its fast coming to that point now its automatic if selby in a match and players looking for a get out its easy option to play negative and blame selby.

Or on the flip side one could say selby fans are happy to divert attention from his poot conversion rate in business end of ranking events by discussing this

GJ wrote:Or on the flip side one could say selby fans are happy to divert attention from his poot conversion rate in business end of ranking events by discussing this

sod all to do with that

or it could be fans of other players are looking for an excuse as to why a frame or match is slow.

Wild wrote:

GJ wrote:Or on the flip side one could say selby fans are happy to divert attention from his poot conversion rate in business end of ranking events by discussing this

sod all to do with that

or it could be fans of other players are looking for an excuse as to why a frame or match is slow.

I have watched and played enough snooker over the years to accept that not all frames are fast and free flowing, this is not about speed and I'm not criticising Mark Selby's ability as a player. I do however wonder if he let go of the shackles of what I perceive to be negative play that he would start to win many more titles.

Wild, when I get my PC working on Friday I will collate a list of just how many run ups to the pack he did in the matches I have on my Hard drives.