Well done John Higgins

hendo is the GOAT at hitting the pink full in face from blue and spitting reds

GJ wrote:hendo is the GOAT at hitting the pink full in face from blue and spitting reds

yes and ronnie is the GOAT for spliting the pack from potting the black

Rocket_ron wrote:

GJ wrote:hendo is the GOAT at hitting the pink full in face from blue and spitting reds

yes and ronnie is the GOAT for spliting the pack from potting the black

ronald

You can pick out Joe Johnson and Dennis Taylor but Hendry did beat only Nigel Bond in one of his titles (the rest were legends he beat). However, equally modern day a lot of people don't rate Graeme Dott yet he has made 3 finals (so do we negate one of Ronnie's titles for only beating Dott)?

Sorry but 90's was very competitive from 93 onwards from which point Higgins, Williams and O'Sullivan were multiple title winners yet couldn't break Hendry in the world's until late 90's why?

Infact a look at the top 16 when Hendry started his dominance at the start of the 90s shows among his rivals were Griffiths, Hallet, Thorburn, Taylor, Higgins, Thorne, Mountjoy, Knowles, Virgo, Meo, Reynolds, White and Davis.

So what was different to new kid on the block Hendry coming along dominating amongst older players past their best than there was with new kid on the block Davis coming along a decade earlier and dominating against older players in the top 16 like Reardon, Charlton, Spencer, Davis, Mans, Webenuik, Pulman and interstingly Higgins, Taylor, Thorne, Virgo, Thorburn, Griffiths and Mountjoy who were STILL there when Hendrys dominance began and were to continue to be regular fixtures in the top 16 and at the tournaments well into the 90s whilst Hendry dominated.

There slide down the rankings and eventual dissapearance of the tour happened in parallel to Hendrys era of dominance ending. Coincidence or what?

this thread has gone way of topic

Hendry "invented" the split into pink and reds from blue although it was played before that, Hendry was the one remembered for it because he was the first to deliberately use it time and time again. But I tell you who is the best at it. Ding Junhui

Sonny wrote:Hendry "invented" the split into pink and reds from blue although it was played before that, Hendry was the one remembered for it because he was the first to deliberately use it time and time again. But I tell you who is the best at it. Ding Junhui

DING JOHN WAY

Caledonian Craig wrote:You can pick out Joe Johnson and Dennis Taylor but Hendry did beat only Nigel Bond in one of his titles (the rest were legends he beat). However, equally modern day a lot of people don't rate Graeme Dott yet he has made 3 finals (so do we negate one of Ronnie's titles for only beating Dott)?

Sorry but 90's was very competitive from 93 onwards from which point Higgins, Williams and O'Sullivan were multiple title winners yet couldn't break Hendry in the world's until late 90's why?

Higgins, Williams and Ronnie all multiple title winners from 1993

Why do you think Hendry virtually always faced a legend in the final?

Because the early 90s was so weak that him and White cruised through their halves of the draw such was the lack of competition. Would this happen now, 4/5 years the same 2 players contesting the final

Joe Johnson and Dennis Taylor are far bigger legends than Bond

why is ding better than hendo at blue to red?

Sonny wrote:Hendry "invented" the split into pink and reds from blue although it was played before that, Hendry was the one remembered for it because he was the first to deliberately use it time and time again. But I tell you who is the best at it. Ding Junhui

Hendry invented it. that infuriates me cos ive seen plenty of old footage of Davis, White and Alex doing this shot.

Its a bit like saying Hendry and Ronnie invented the 147 cos there the best at it

When trying to work out GOAT everything must be taken into account and each player has their own handicap to their stats.

Davis - masterful in the 80's but formed dipped gradually in the early to mid-90's onwards so his stats include his poor seasons since his hey day.

Hendry - masterful in the 90's but form started dipping at around 2003 I'd say so since then his poor seasons are included as well in his stats.

O'Sullivan - some will argue he wasn't ready in the 90's (odd since he won UK Title in 93 and that title is a great form guide for worlds) so his stats include the 90's, the 00's the purple patch of his career plus his dip just recently.

Higgins - again some will argue he wasn't ready in the 90's. I don't agree but his stats don't really suffer any real dip in form.

Williams - again some will say the mid-90's he wasn't ready I'd disagree but his handicap is his big dip in form around 2007 or so.

There you have it we need to look at all stats and each player has their blips in their career.

Witz78 wrote:

Sonny wrote:Hendry "invented" the split into pink and reds from blue although it was played before that, Hendry was the one remembered for it because he was the first to deliberately use it time and time again. But I tell you who is the best at it. Ding Junhui

Hendry invented it. that infuriates me cos ive seen plenty of old footage of Davis, White and Alex doing this shot.

Its a bit like saying Hendry and Ronnie invented the 147 cos there the best at it

I think when they say he invented it, it's because he was the first to perfect it and show it as a viable shot to play for because until then it was usually black used to split the back. You've got to give him some credit, when he showed up he was on a different level to those we'd grown up watching in the 80's.

Love the avatar btw

Wild wrote:

Witz78 wrote:

Wild wrote:Witz

there is absalutly no arguament about it just factual statement on my part.

i was watching the tournaments steve was winning and believe me if you thought hendry had no compatition you missed out with Steve then

Funny how in 1994 when Hendry had already had the bulk of his dominance that the same no hopers Davis has to contend with a decade earlier were among the elite and Hendrys main rivals, except they were even more past their bests.

1993/94 -
Thorne 7th in the world
Griffiths 8th
Foulds 14th
Taylor 15th

you had the likes of Davis (past his peak) White and Parrot as rival to Hendry then even though these guys had all been around a good while too then such illustrious names as Roe, James, Clark, Morgan, Wilkinson as the other threats.

Only once Doherty, Ebdon, Ronnie, Williams, Higgins emerged properly into top players did the old guard and these non entities listed above rapidly decline, and coincidentally Hendry also declines suddenly as some serious competition arrives.

I maintain that Davis had far greater competition than Hendry did. Davis dominace was more impressive and conclusive IMO.

you can maintain it all you like its still bull

bull cos you dont agree with it

1 Major in the last 15 years says it all

Its at times like this i miss Seifer

Sonny wrote:I think when they say he invented it, it's because he was the first to perfect it and show it as a viable shot to play for because until then it was usually black used to split the back. You've got to give him some credit, when he showed up he was on a different level to those we'd grown up watching in the 80's.

witz giving hendo credit

davis greatest of 80's
hendry greatest of 90's
ronnie and higgins greatest of 00's

Hendry GOAT

Wild wrote:

Rocket_ron wrote:this thread has gone way of topic

that what happens with witz and the Rochdale one ..

ive always maintained there is a genuine argument for Ronnie even John Higgins now but take it from someone thats old enough there really not a single argument to add Steve's name in to the mix as the GOAT.

Ron, this thread STARTED off topic with your opening line that Higgins was now the 3rd greatest player ever

Hendry had it all his own way for a number of years before the rest caught up and the rest had to be young blood. It doesn't detract from Hendry, it shows how much he raised the bar that those previous names became hasbeens as soon as he showed up.

well he is...how is fact offtopic?

By 1995, between them O'Sullivan, Higgins and Williams had won five ranking titles so yes they were definite contenders and by 1997 all three were ranked inside the top seven.

Caledonian Craig wrote:By 1995, between them O'Sullivan, Higgins and Williams had won five ranking titles so yes they were definite contenders and by 1997 all three were ranked inside the top seven.

good stat

Wild wrote:

Rocket_ron wrote:this thread has gone way of topic

that what happens with witz and the Rochdale one ..

ive always maintained there is a genuine argument for Ronnie even John Higgins now but take it from someone thats old enough there really not a single argument to add Steve's name in to the mix as the GOAT.

A minute ago yous were using Ranking totals won as the guage of greatness

Now youve moved the goalposts and Davis whos 2nd on the ranking list isnt a credible contender for GOAT but Higgins and Ronnie are despite having less rankers and less Majors.

Talk about picking and choosing when facts suit your argument

Sonny wrote:Hendry had it all his own way for a number of years before the rest caught up and the rest had to be young blood. It doesn't detract from Hendry, it shows how much he raised the bar that those previous names became hasbeens as soon as he showed up.

these same guys who were Davis's rivals in the 80s were dismissed by Wild as being no hopers yet he choses to ignore the fact that the bulk of the top 16 in the early 90s still consisted of these very same guys

Rocket_ron wrote:well he is...how is fact offtopic?

Hes NOT the 3rd greatest of all time

Hes the 3rd most ranking titles to his name

not hard to work out the difference

If we go with your logic then Dominic Dale is more successful than Alex Higgins

witz,

look

1 hendry
2 Davis
3 Higgins
4 o'sullivan
5 Wliiliams
6 White

thats my oppinion.

Rocket_ron wrote:witz,

look

1 hendry
2 Davis
3 Higgins
4 o'sullivan
5 Wliiliams
6 White

thats my oppinion.

white is to high up