Higgins fears for future

Good article, but that just emphasises the point even more that Ronnie is way above the rest in terms of natural ability and able to adapt to every cue and table condition for instance. Ronnie too is probably the only player who I've never heard complain about table conditions, etc, he just gets on with it, win or lose. There might have been some cases as described there that players adapted well to a new cue, but that is an exception, not the rule.

He's also physically fit which is why he can keep going for longer. So funny seeing him run, did any of you catch it on the Masters coverage? Run Forrest run

edwards2000 wrote:The cue thing doesn't make any sense at all away from psychological issues. Tennis racquets are changed every set or more, darts and parts of the dart are changed routinely. In football, conditions are never the same from game to game. Equipment changes in most sports. In snooker, for some reason, a different cue or a different tip has people running around like the Blitz is on.

If your career relies so much on the particular piece of wood you are using, you have a problem. Not the cue. I don't mean Higgins here either, I mean in general there is a hysteria.

The density of wood changes making the hit of each cue virtually unique.

You can get them close but even cues made by the same manufacturer will vary depending on the batch of wood being worked with. The best manufacturers who work closely with players will set aside particularly good batches of wood to make the custom cues for the pros to make switching cues (if needed) as painless as possible. In the case of Ronnie I wouldn't be surprised to find Parris set aside certain batches of wood to make his cues from.

Tennis....the variance from racquet to racquet is how tightly the strings are done and the material. Hitting with one racquet to the next involves virtually no change in feel as long as you maintain the same string material and tightness. Overhitting a shot in tennis by a matter of inches isn't often a huge problem, that's not the case with snooker.

Darts....where does feel come into this? You're talking purely weight when it comes to darts so unless you swap out a part that will affect the weight you're not going to impact your play.

Golf would be more comperable and players certainly switch equipment if their standard swing isn't netting them their expected results. Even then though, in golf the consistency in the feel of equipment from one manufacturer is virtually always there, metal and graphite doesn't have the variance that you get from wood.

I think the material involved and the feel requirement of the sport dictates how important the equipment is to the player. In the case of snooker, discount the importance of the cue at your peril.

Very good post sickpotter, and good comparisons there, definately agree.

I wonder if there's somewhere we can go to find out what players have switched their cue, how many times and for what reason(s).

Cue worries are not a sign of a mentally weak player.

Hendry certainly couldn't be considered mentally weak and he struggled with it.

Higgins also certainly isn't considered mentally weak and he's struggling.

Ronnie hasn't struggled with it and he's certainly not considered a pillar of mental strength.

If it is a psychological problem that is the root of a problem adjusting to a new cue, then that is most certainly down to mental strength. It doesn't have to be the same kind of mental issue as clearing up under pressure or dealing with a time waster. It's a mental weakness of a different kind (not being able to move on from it and understanding that the cue isn't what won you the titles. Your own ability was.) But as far as I know, no one except Hendry's fans have made an issue of Hendry and his cue.

Even if Hendry had the same cue he won those Worlds for his entire career, i still don't think he would have been 8 times world champ because he was so close to win his 8th in 2002 but couldn't and that certainly wasn't because he was using a diferent cue

But it plays a part no doubt, especially on the use of side spin, it is only over a long term, say 1 or 2 years that if a player can't adapt to that cue it becomes more of a psychological problem than anything else.

But edwards if you are a Ronnie fan mate you are vastly underestimating Ronnie's natural talent to win that 2009 Masters with a new cue he had barely been practicing for 4 or 5 hours. That's just insane what he did there.

I am not underestimating his talent, I am saying that it is completely illogical to say on one hand that the cue is a major factor in success, and on the other, see a guy win a major with a cue he had practised with for one hour. It doesn't fit. No doubt, he is a one off, and doing what he did was incredible, but if the cue was THAT big of a factor, not even he could have pulled it off. I have followed Ronnie for 10 years, and I think people use his natural talent as an excuse to downplay his achievements, way too much. It's not "wow, he's great to do that" it has become "oh, natural talent". It's bullocks.

Finally, let us suppose that the cue really is a major thing. What does that say about other players like Hendry? That they got lucky with that particular cue, and all their titles needed that one perfect piece of wood?

I'm not buying that at all.

Tough if your buying it or not it just happens to be fact now could we all drop this bullocks because this thread has sod all to do with Ronnie.

Oh, another of your facts. How silly of me :P

Also, Hendry might have a thing or two to say about what made him successful. And I bet the cue is rank bottom.

Anyway, I agree... this is totally off-topic.

edwards2000 wrote:I am not underestimating his talent, I am saying that it is completely illogical to say on one hand that the cue is a major factor in success, and on the other, see a guy win a major with a cue he had practised with for one hour. It doesn't fit. No doubt, he is a one off, and doing what he did was incredible, but if the cue was THAT big of a factor, not even he could have pulled it off. I have followed Ronnie for 10 years, and I think people use his natural talent as an excuse to downplay his achievements, way too much. It's not "wow, he's great to do that" it has become "oh, natural talent". It's bullocks.

Finally, let us suppose that the cue really is a major thing. What does that say about other players like Hendry? That they got lucky with that particular cue, and all their titles needed that one perfect piece of wood?

I'm not buying that at all.

You seem to be holding up Ronnie's achievement of winning an event with a new cue like it's the norm.

It's not. Name me one other player who's done anything like it. Even Ronnie has acknowledged how unusual it was.

Don't tell me Parris doesn't have a 1/2 dozen cues made to Ronnie's specs all just waiting for his use. If the differences from cue to cue are not involving an significant change in how you play with side and the feel is close one can produce some great stuff.

Did Ronnie keep the cue or switch to another after that famous win? The longer you play with a cue the more the marginal differences in the hit will play on you. Great players can adjust on the fly but eventually the continual adjusting will wear on your confidence.

If the feel/hit of the cue is so irrelevant why was 10000 pounds offered up as a reward for Hendry's old cue when it was stolen? The cue was worth 60 pounds brand new but 10k was on offer.....and paid out for a crooked old piece of crap. Why? You can't replicate a warped piece of wood and how it hits.

In retrospect it was probably a mistake for Hendry not to change to a custom cue maker earlier. It certainly would've made it easier to get a replacement with a similar hit.

I think to a great extent the ability to switch cues easily will depend on if you're a "touch/feel" type player or one that's more technical. If the ratio of technique to feel falls heavily on the feel side that player will have a harder time switching cues.

It would be fun and a good chance for cue makers to showcase their products if they had an event where the top players showed a couple of hours before their match and picked a cue from the offerings to play with.

First of all, hello all! New board member from Canada.....I just want to say one thing about this debate you guys are having.

I play tennis (not a pro but I'm pretty good) and using a different racquet, though it throws you off, you can adjust and play pretty well still.

In terms of snooker, I'm more of an 8 ball player so I can't say anything definitively....I really do love to watch snooker, though, so don't put me down :). However, when I do play pool and use a different cue, the feel is much harder to adjust to than when I play tennis, for example....

There's also something else I heard that may be relevant here. I play golf a lot, and one of the guys I played with mentioned how when a pro had his driver broken (travelling), it took him so long to adjust to the new driver. The new driver was IDENTICAL in terms of specs, but though it's supposed to be identical, there's always a little bit of variance which changes the feel. I think that's sort of what some people on this board are alluding to when they mention the feel of the cue. Though it's made to be the exact same as the previous cue, it'll NEVER be the exact same. Some players (like the rocket) possess the natural talent to somehow conquer it.....some guys don't.

Also, in my opinion, you'd notice it a lot more for top level players than middle of the pack guys.....top level players are more precise, and so, they would probably be punished more if the new cue was bothering their feel. Top level guys will play better safeties and make more pots, so 1 miss out of the ordinary will have a bigger influence on them than it would on a middle of the pack type of player.....

Just my 2 cents!

Ps. i joined this board because I just watched the Ebdon-Hang match.....I placed a little wager on Ebdon and man, if I didn't know any better, I'd think he threw the match! He lost 4-0 and could have won by the same scoreline :S.....anyway, nice to see a live snooker board!

rocketronnie147 wrote:First of all, hello all! New board member from Canada.....I just want to say one thing about this debate you guys are having.

I play tennis (not a pro but I'm pretty good) and using a different racquet, though it throws you off, you can adjust and play pretty well still.

In terms of snooker, I'm more of an 8 ball player so I can't say anything definitively....I really do love to watch snooker, though, so don't put me down :). However, when I do play pool and use a different cue, the feel is much harder to adjust to than when I play tennis, for example....

There's also something else I heard that may be relevant here. I play golf a lot, and one of the guys I played with mentioned how when a pro had his driver broken (travelling), it took him so long to adjust to the new driver. The new driver was IDENTICAL in terms of specs, but though it's supposed to be identical, there's always a little bit of variance which changes the feel. I think that's sort of what some people on this board are alluding to when they mention the feel of the cue. Though it's made to be the exact same as the previous cue, it'll NEVER be the exact same. Some players (like the rocket) possess the natural talent to somehow conquer it.....some guys don't.

Also, in my opinion, you'd notice it a lot more for top level players than middle of the pack guys.....top level players are more precise, and so, they would probably be punished more if the new cue was bothering their feel. Top level guys will play better safeties and make more pots, so 1 miss out of the ordinary will have a bigger influence on them than it would on a middle of the pack type of player.....

Just my 2 cents!

Ps. i joined this board because I just watched the Ebdon-Hang match.....I placed a little wager on Ebdon and man, if I didn't know any better, I'd think he threw the match! He lost 4-0 and could have won by the same scoreline :S.....anyway, nice to see a live snooker board!

Welcome to the Forum rocketronnie147

I bolded that part because it just about says it all about this debate. Top players will need more time to adapt to a new cue and are way more precise like you say than a regular club player, so especially when they need to use side spin on the cue ball a new cue does make a big difference initially, and that's what's happening with Higgins at the moment.

Of course that's not the sole reason for him to be in decline, far from it, but it does play a part no doubt.