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Re: Stephen Lee - 12 year ban for match fixing

Postby Roland

GJ has it. I watched it live, managed to find a stream after he came on Twitter to announce he and Dotty were going to be on.

Re: Stephen Lee - 12 year ban for match fixing

Postby Raziel

Witz78 wrote:The excessive and sham verdict didn't surprise me.

The haters got the result they were after.

If you think that was a sham verdict, I can only assume that you don't understand how civil cases work.


Civil cases are decided on the balance of probability. Therefore, in a civil case, if you cannot (or refuse to) provide evidence which refutes the evidence against you - then it is 100% certain that you will be found guilty!

In that hearing, Stephen Lee basically hung himself with his own mouth.

By refusing to provide certain documents that he was asked to provide, and by also spouting a lot of pretty unbelievable scenarios with no supporting evidence, Stephen Lee made it literally IMPOSSIBLE that he could be found not guilty.

I'm sorry, but it definitely was not a sham verdict. Anyone who chaired that hearing would have been obliged by Law to find him guilty, even if he was actually INNOCENT!

Re: Stephen Lee - 12 year ban for match fixing

Postby Wildey

Raziel

Witz is the champion of the underdog and Stephen Lee was so far down as the underdog Witz had to support him no matter how Damning Evidence was.

Re: Stephen Lee - 12 year ban for match fixing

Postby Wildey

Sonny wrote:Check out this crock of rubbish

http://sportiseverything.com/2013/10/01 ... ephen-lee/

If you're going to write and publish an article on something, at least make an attempt to know what you're talking about.

unbelievable <doh>


but that what happens when ill advised cretins write about things they know rubbish about.

Ronnie's Latest effort is he cant understand why 128 players don't go over to china to play a tournament.

Re: Stephen Lee - 12 year ban for match fixing

Postby Mal

Stephen Lee being interviewed now by Andy Goldstein on Talksport. Talked about his appeal, lawyers, and his match vs Higgins in PL (where they did both play bad). Not gone into the finances in as much detail as I'd like. (yet?)

Re: Stephen Lee - 12 year ban for match fixing

Postby Wildey

Sonny wrote:http://www.snookerbacker.com/2013/10/10/lee-protests-his-innocence/

He threw the PL match, you have to be an idiot to think he didn't.

That interview was Laughable he protested so much it had a feel of someone trying to convince him self first and foremost never mind anyone else.

Re: Stephen Lee - 12 year ban for match fixing

Postby Raziel

So Stephen Lee has lodged notice that he is going to appeal!

I can't wait to read the transcript of his appeal hearing. It's going to be absolutely hilarious.

Mind you, this kind of thing happens all the time with criminals who have just been sent to prison. They have nothing to lose by making an appeal, so they just do it.

Stephen Lee has virtually ZERO chance of winning any kind of appeal. But, conversely, he also has nothing to lose by appealing.

If he loses and gets a longer ban, then it doesn't matter. Because, at the age of 38, twelve years is essentially equivalent to a life ban anyway.

If he loses and gets another huge set of court costs levied against him, then he just won't pay it.

And also, with the amount of unpaid CCJs he already has against him, it wouldn't surprise me if he bumps his current lawyer for his legal bill as well.

After all, what's a few more CCJs against you going to matter when you already have so many.

It also wouldn't surprise me if the next thing he does is to declare bankruptcy, so he will only have to pay a fraction of what he owes various people.

Stephen Lee is like an open book which is very easy to read.

Re: Stephen Lee - 12 year ban for match fixing

Postby GJ

Just listened to that interview and for me hes either a great actor or he is innocent because he didnt stutter once he was clear with everything he said.

Re: Stephen Lee - 12 year ban for match fixing

Postby Wildey

GJ wrote:Just listened to that interview and for me hes either a great actor or he is innocent because he didnt stutter once he was clear with everything he said.

it was well practiced and hes said it so often in his own head it was second nature for him but i think there were a few stutters there which he hid by swallowing his own spit.

Re: Stephen Lee - 12 year ban for match fixing

Postby GJ

Wildey wrote:
GJ wrote:Just listened to that interview and for me hes either a great actor or he is innocent because he didnt stutter once he was clear with everything he said.

it was well practiced and hes said it so often in his own head it was second nature for him but i think there were a few stutters there which he hid by swallowing his own spit.



fair point on reflection i suppose alot of guilty people do become deluded enough to get it in to their own head that their innocent.

my only issue then is what grounds has he for appeal , surely he cant just do it without good grounds :shrug:

Re: Stephen Lee - 12 year ban for match fixing

Postby snooky147

He was given the opportunity to provide Bank Statements and other proof that would cover the money in question. He failed to do this. If by some miracle he does indeed produce these statements and they are all in order(just saw a flying pig) then he should still be banned for wasting everyones time.
But I think we all know none of that will happen.

Re: Stephen Lee - 12 year ban for match fixing

Postby Wildey

snooky147 wrote:He was given the opportunity to provide Bank Statements and other proof that would cover the money in question. He failed to do this. If by some miracle he does indeed produce these statements and they are all in order(just saw a flying pig) then he should still be banned for wasting everyones time.
But I think we all know none of that will happen.

it really beggars belief that he had 11 months to provide proof and failed and now in about 3 weeks since the verdict he claims to have proof.

Re: Stephen Lee - 12 year ban for match fixing

Postby Raziel

snooky147 wrote:He was given the opportunity to provide Bank Statements and other proof that would cover the money in question. He failed to do this. If by some miracle he does indeed produce these statements and they are all in order (just saw a flying pig) then he should still be banned for wasting everyones time.
But I think we all know none of that will happen.

What Stephen Lee does not seem to realize is that it won't make any difference even of he does provide proof that all the money paid into his wife's bank account was legitimately earned "tour money".

There is still all the suspicious betting pattern evidence against him. And the probability of these suspicious betting patterns occurring in concordance with Stephen Lee's related frame/match scores by pure chance is literally millions-to-one against.

In his defence, Stephen Lee argued that he was not the cause of these suspicious betting patterns. So, in effect, what he was saying was that this millions-to-one against occurrence must have happened by pure chance alone.

And, in a civil hearing, where your guilt or innocence is decided on the balance of probability, this argument is going to be seen as absolutely ridiculous.

So, basically, he's going to be found guilty once again.

Re: Stephen Lee - 12 year ban for match fixing

Postby gallantrabbit

I thought the interview was horrible and only made him sound worse. Goldstein was awful too. No balls to really challenge him. Of course Lee will get nowhere. If I were him I'd be planning how to make a living rather than following this futile effort.

Re: Stephen Lee - 12 year ban for match fixing

Postby Raziel

According to this:

LINK: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/others ... ?ico=sport

It looks like the Daily Mail refused to pay £5,000 for Stephen Lee's "story".

"Lee, I was told, had gone underground. He’d changed his mobile telephone number and was not taking calls. But one voice message left with his friend Adam Quigley, the owner of the Pockets snooker hall in Cheltenham, and Lee was on the phone.

You could quickly hear that sense of desperation in his voice. Didn’t want to say too much until we’d discussed how much. I said we had no money to offer him. He said he’d ‘press the button’ for as little as 5k.’"

Re: Stephen Lee - 12 year ban for match fixing

Postby snooky147

gallantrabbit wrote:I thought the interview was horrible and only made him sound worse. Goldstein was awful too. No balls to really challenge him. Of course Lee will get nowhere. If I were him I'd be planning how to make a living rather than following this futile effort.


I detest Goldstein, How he got in any position in the media is completely beyond me.

Re: Stephen Lee - 12 year ban for match fixing

Postby Ayrshirebhoy

Will commentators ever mention his name again during matches? Like if there talking about smooth cueing action will They mention him or like in wrestling it will be like he never existed?

Re: Stephen Lee - 12 year ban for match fixing

Postby Andre147

Ayrshirebhoy wrote:Will commentators ever mention his name again during matches? Like if there talking about smooth cueing action will They mention him or like in wrestling it will be like he never existed?


That's a good question really, I for one don't think they will mention him, at least when commentating on the actual matches. In the studio interviews etc Hazel for instance in the beeb might mention him when refering to match fixing or other problems in snooker. Otherwise, don't think we'll ever hear his name again, rightly so.

Re: Stephen Lee - 12 year ban for match fixing

Postby Wildey

According to Janie Watkins on Twitter Stephen Lee "cant play 8 or 9 ball or billiards nor carom. All cue sports bodies honour each other's bans under WCBS with IPA, Carom."

i think that's right as well

Re: Stephen Lee - 12 year ban for match fixing

Postby Snooker Overdrive

This is my first and probably my last post concerning Stephen Lee. Better late than never, right?

It's a shame it had to end this way for Stephen Lee who I always considered a good or even very good player. He seemed like a model professional (apart from the stature) and a fair sportsman. But things are not always as they seem in life. I took a couple of hours of my time and looked at some of matches in question. Two matches shocked me especially.
1) World Championship 2009 against Ryan Day: I just can't believe how on earth a professional can even think about throwing a match in the most sacred of all places snooker has to offer, on the biggest stage possible! Truly unbelievable.
2) Premier League 2012 against Higgins: He was in the form of his life for a year or so and what does he do? He fixes yet again a match, that's just so stupid it's beyond believe. He was earning plenty of money at the time but it seems he still couldn't get enough. To think no would notice is mind boggling naive, especially considering how many strange and terrible shots he played on camera.

World Snooker had no other option but to punish his actions severely. It's the only way to secure the integrity of the sport. I will miss his talent and his quality on the table but he had to go. There's no place for match fixers in snooker. But I take no pleasure from seeing Stephen Lee now probably bankrupt and with his professional life completely ruined. His fall is a tragedy but hopefully it will serve as a warning and will prevent other players from corrupting our great sport we all love.